Recycling, try again...

For topics unrelated to bush walking or to the forums.

Recycling, try again...

Postby tasadam » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 9:09 am

Following on from viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1236
tasadamon Tue 28 Oct, 2008 10:53 am wrote:Devonport City Council...
"To put into landfill because it's cheaper because we can keep the money for ourselves......"
There's more to it but I've only heard the facts third hand at this stage.

Recycling in Devonport looks to end due to the lack of future-sightedness and caring by a handful of aldermen.
Firstly, there was this newspaper article.
Waiting to see the outcome before posting again, the State Government looks set to intervene as this article says.
Of note,
"Recycling is a key component in any modern waste management regime and it is embarrassing that the actions of half a dozen councillors are holding an entire region to ransom while council debates the obvious benefits of recycling," Ms O'Connor said.

Nicely put.
The Greens have let out a Media Release on this too.
So now the council thinks about trying again as this article says.

What's it got to do with bushwalking?
Well we all seem to be a fairly environmentally consciouis group. And what recycling that doesn't make it to the tip is going to end up in our environment - which includes areas that we walk in.
Just thought I would share the news.
User avatar
tasadam
Magnus administratio
Magnus administratio
 
Posts: 5932
Joined: Tue 10 Apr, 2007 6:58 pm
Location: Near Devonport, Tasmania
ASSOCIATED ORGANISATIONS: TasmaniART, Smitten Merino, Macpac
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby Nuts » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 9:29 am

Yes, crazy situation, the irony in it. Like mentioned, I was in :shock: that the recycling actually cost!
There will come a time when it is viable? Or always just a 'token' effort?
My bin was stolen, better go up to Gunns and buy a new one? :roll:
坚果
Nuts
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 7853
Joined: Sat 05 Apr, 2008 12:22 pm
Region: Tasmania

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby frank_in_oz » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 10:25 am

In Geelong we have had an excellent recycling program since 2004.

We get 3 bins:
2 large ones for recycling and green waste (collected alternate weeks)
1 small one for rubbish.(collected weekly)

The City of Greater Geelong (COGG) have a great program and more info is listed here: http://www.geelongcity.vic.gov.au/Servi ... and_Waste/

This is some of their information relevant to what has been discussed - taken from the COGG website:
Absolute rubbish
According to Eco Recycle Australia, on a per person basis, Australia is one of the highest producers of garbage in the world. Every year we bury enough garbage to fill Kardinia Park to the point posts. Apart from the financial maintenance costs, garbage buried in landfill doesn't breakdown. It remains a problem for future generations.

The price of landfill
At current prices, it costs $25,000 per week to bury waste in landfill. That's $1.3 million every year. Put another way our waste costs us approximately $35 per tonne.

Landfill sites are also being subjected to increasingly stringent environmental standards. The Geelong community currently pays $1 million per year in State Government landfill levies, but with recent changes to legislation, this will increase to $3 million over the next five years if current waste volumes continue. If we keep going the way we have been, in ten years time we will be paying between $50 to $60 per tonne, and that's before inflation. The City of Greater Geelong will run out of space at its current landfill sites if we don't reduce our annual garbage pile.

Establishing a new landfill site would cost between $5 to $6 million and that's assuming a suitable site could ever be found. After all, would you like a new tip in your suburb? Our old landfill sites will also require $11 million to rehabiltate.

How to save on garbage
We don't have to keep paying so much for our garbage. Reducing the amount of garbage that ends up in landfill will ultimately reduce the overall cost of garbage to the community. And it's easy to do. The City of Greater Geelong's three-bin recycling and waste collection system gives everyone the opportunity to recycle, reuse and reduce. Recyclable materials and garden waste can now be easily separated, ready for kerb side collection.

Green waste saves money
Green waste currently costs around $27 per tonne to turn into compost and mulch. Compared to $35 per tonne to bury our general waste. With increased environmental requirements this will soon increase to some $60 per tonne. Since 30% of Geelong's landfill is currently made up of green waste, your green waste bin is a powerful weapon in the fight to reduce the cost of garbage.

Reduced energy consumption
Recycling plastic drink bottles takes 84% less energy than it takes to make plastic bottles from the raw materials. The source materials for most plastics are fossil fuels like crude oil, gas and coal. Making new aluminium cans from recycled cans uses only 5% of the energy required to make cans from the raw materials. Less energy during manufacture keeps down the purchase price and reduces demand on finite energy reserves.

Edit: source of info!
Last edited by frank_in_oz on Fri 31 Oct, 2008 10:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Frank
Check out "Our Hiking Blog" Overland Track guide, Food to Go-recipe ideas and Trekking to Everest Base Camp.
User avatar
frank_in_oz
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 372
Joined: Fri 02 Nov, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: Geelong, Vic

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby tasadam » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 10:33 am

If that is taken from the Geelong council web site, then Devonport Council must be the laughing stock of the country, in council circles.
Devonport Council - Giving Tasmania the reputation it is being increasingly known for. Six of them say, nah, we don't wanna recycle, there's plenty of landfill.
How frustrating. You think by now there would be some law that meant we the public could take them to the high court or something - surely there must be some environment act in parliament somewhere that says there must be a recycle plan ??
Any Pollies out there reading, want to take up the cause?

(Big recycle bin in Devonport where all recycle could be taken - known as Council Chambers ??)
User avatar
tasadam
Magnus administratio
Magnus administratio
 
Posts: 5932
Joined: Tue 10 Apr, 2007 6:58 pm
Location: Near Devonport, Tasmania
ASSOCIATED ORGANISATIONS: TasmaniART, Smitten Merino, Macpac
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby sthughes » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 11:18 am

Anyone know which 6 (originally 8) councilors voted to abolish recycling? I'd like to know who not to vote for next time around.

Nice to see Ald Bill Wilson is thinking of himself first and foremost with his policy that the tip will last longer than him so who cares about extra landfill! So typical of politicians to wait until too late to fix a problem.

Grr - this really makes me irate. Almost as much as the quantity of useless packaging you get (like it or not) when you buy something. I think there should be laws to prevent things from having so much completley unnecessary packaging to begin with! Like dishwashing liquid that is watered down to make it appear better value and use twice as much packaging, and of course to buy a refill for lots of products costs more than the original with all the extra packaging.

I could whinge for ages on this but I'll shut up (especially seem it's a bit off topic) - you all know what I mean though! :evil:
"Don't do today what you can put off 'till tomorrow." (Work that is!)
User avatar
sthughes
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 2427
Joined: Wed 05 Mar, 2008 12:53 pm
Location: Ulverstone
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby johnw » Fri 31 Oct, 2008 12:02 pm

sthughes wrote:and of course to buy a refill for lots of products costs more than the original with all the extra packaging.

Not to menton that whenever some electrical appliance, car part etc fails and usually can't be economically repaired (or was designed to be unrepairable :evil:). You end up being forced to throw it out and buy a new one (with all the extra packaging).

sthughes wrote:I'll shut up (especially seem it's a bit off topic)

I don't think it's OT. It all leads to waste that has to be dealt with in some way - hopefully by recycling.
John W

In Nature's keeping they are safe, but through the agency of man destruction is making rapid progress - John Muir c1912
User avatar
johnw
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 4813
Joined: Wed 23 Jan, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Macarthur Region - SW Sydney
Region: New South Wales
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby Nuts » Sun 02 Nov, 2008 10:15 am

I guess it's up to others to decide what issues a relevant to bushwalking. I guess this one is a bit remote?
I was initially shocked that recycling actually Costs! I wonder if these other councils make any Profit?

I wonder if it points back to Devonport, more than the councils recycling program, a truck drives down my street to pick up perhaps 2 bins from 40/50 houses.....

I'm not sure where the real problem lies. I hate to see these environmental causes lean on the 'for our kids' jumbo every time something seems to have no immediate benefit. It seems like just as easy a 'cop out' as any side to these debates use. I'd rather see good management to begin with and a way to make these things work Now.

A quick short term answer, which has been mentioned, would be to start charging companies for packaging. Yes, it'll be us that pays anyhow, but at least they may think about packaging twice and it would force 'the great uncaring' to just follow...

Anyhow...

Oh, Just one more point- I would think twice about posting peoples names here, no matter.
坚果
Nuts
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 7853
Joined: Sat 05 Apr, 2008 12:22 pm
Region: Tasmania

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby walkinTas » Sun 02 Nov, 2008 10:28 pm

I'd be interested to know what percentage of houses in Devonport actually recycle. Does anyone know the official figures?

Several people I have spoken to have complained about either being confused as to what can be placed in the recycle basket, or about having put the basket out only to see it sit there all week and never get collected. The second of these was my own experience on more than one occasion. (And anyway, those stupid little baskets are pathetically inadequate).

Councils everywhere moved to only collecting garbage from wheelie bins in order to lower the cost of collection. One truck driver can do what used to take three men, and it is much quicker. So why persist with a labour intensive recycling system.

As far as I can tell, the Devonport Council isn't against recycling, just the expense of curb-side recycling. Its easy to take cheap shots at politician and councilors. Here is a challenge for you. Come up with an cost-effective alternative that really works, one that actually encourages people to recycle. :)

What we need is a more inventive (and cheaper) way to recycle. For example, neighbourhood recycle bins in each street. People could carry their recycle basket as far as the neighbourhood recycle bin- a number of colour coded skip type bins. The council could send a truck to collect each neighbourhood skip. More expensive to set up, but cheaper to run (all I can think of right now). How would you tackle the problem?

Alternatively, you might come up with a means of limiting the amount of house hold rubbish in the first place. Simple things like: banking online and stopping monthly banking statements; reading the newpaper online (no newspapers); and shredding and composting other household paper. When you shop do you consciously make an effort to buy only containers that can be recycled? Have you stopped using plastic shopping bags?

The above are things individuals can do to limit the amount of household rubbish, but this will only scratch the surface. In 2002 Australia produced approximately 32.4 million tonnes of landfill waste. The USA produced approximately 409 million tons (USA waste rose 165% between 1990 and 2002). Recycling is part of the story. Limiting the amount of waste in the first place is a more important concern. And when it comes to recycling we don't even get that part of the story right. The Greens estimate that Tasmanian "diversion rates for solid waste are half the national average".

We have become a consumer society that generates massive amounts of waste. For example a recent "report estimates that 900,000 computers were dumped in landfill in Australia last year". And it is worse! This is only 3.5% of the estimate obsolete computers. "The report says that 69 per cent are stockpiled, 26 per cent reused and just 1.5 per cent recycled". On these figures it is more than twice as likely the 69% will eventually be dumped in landfill rather than recycled.

The other side of the story is who is going to pay for waste recycling? Throughout Australia, including Tasmania, many local governments are facing financial problems with shrinking incomes, rising costs and a backlog in local infrastructure maintenance and renewal. Everyone else produces the rubbish (household waste, industrial waste, construction waste), but somehow it is left to local government to bare the cost of collecting and disposing of it all.

I am a firm believer that people will always take the line of least resistance (ie. do what is easiest to do). To "make" people recycle, you need to do two things: make is cheaper to recycle than to throw it away, and make it easier to recycle than to throw it away. Geelong seem to have made a real effort in this regard.

I am a long way from being a saint when it comes to recycling, so I would be grateful if someone would come up with a few good suggestions that made it all a whole lot easier.

PS: Sorry about the long rant. I started out to make a few quick observations. :D wT.
walkinTas
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 2934
Joined: Thu 07 Jun, 2007 1:51 pm
Region: Tasmania

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby BarryJ » Mon 03 Nov, 2008 5:44 am

Nuts wrote:Yes, crazy situation, the irony in it. Like mentioned, I was in :shock: that the recycling actually cost!
There will come a time when it is viable? Or always just a 'token' effort?
.................................

There are a number of costs associated with recycling:

1. the cost of collection
2. the cost of sorting the material once collected
3. transportation of the material to a processor (often must go to the mainland from Tasmania)
4. treatment by the end processor. Often this isn't much more cost effective for them than using raw materials from scratch.

To explain the last point in a bit more detail, consider paper recycling. Most paper collected for recycling is printed stuff, so the ink must be removed during the recycling process. In many cases, the paper for recycling contains other materials (fillers and binders etc) used in the first paper-making process which also affect the recycling process; these must also be removed at a cost. Finally, because of the additional processing the RECYCLED paper pulp has received as part of the recycling process, the fibres are much shorter than those from FRESH (i.e. newly made from trees) pulp, so there is a limit to the amount of recycled pulp which can be used in many end paper products, otherwise final product quality is affected. Consequently, the amount of paper which can be recycled is limited.
BarryJ
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 207
Joined: Sun 11 Mar, 2007 6:56 pm
Location: Glenorchy, Tasmania
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby tasadam » Mon 03 Nov, 2008 7:22 am

walkinTas wrote:For example a recent "report estimates that 900,000 computers were dumped in landfill in Australia last year". And it is worse! This is only 3.5% of the estimate obsolete computers. "The report says that 69 per cent are stockpiled, 26 per cent reused and just 1.5 per cent recycled". On these figures it is more than twice as likely the 69% will eventually be dumped in landfill rather than recycled.
So where does the problem lie? My thought would be that it lies with the availability of a suitable recepticle for used computers.

A while ago I was required to dispose of a fair abount of obsolete computer equipment - which I happily accepted the challenge as I thought I would take it to the tip to get it all recycled.
To my disgust, there was nowhere they wanted it except in the pit.

On another front, I have heard in the news that the Launceston Council will be removing their 60 litre recycle bins from all households that they have been collecting once a week - and replacing it with 240 litre bins that they will collect once a fortnight.

THIS says it all.
User avatar
tasadam
Magnus administratio
Magnus administratio
 
Posts: 5932
Joined: Tue 10 Apr, 2007 6:58 pm
Location: Near Devonport, Tasmania
ASSOCIATED ORGANISATIONS: TasmaniART, Smitten Merino, Macpac
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male

Re: Recycling, try again...

Postby Son of a Beach » Mon 03 Nov, 2008 9:01 am

I'm in the West Tamar council where we have wheelie bins for recycling. However, our recycling (and our rubbish!) only gets collected once a week.

I had a brief trip to Brisbane recently (where they started recycling with wheelie bins when I was a young kind there on another holiday). I noticed that they now use a single truck, with two compartments, to collect the recycling and the rubbish all in the one truck.
Son of a Beach
Lagarostrobos franklinii
Lagarostrobos franklinii
 
Posts: 6296
Joined: Thu 01 Mar, 2007 7:55 am
Region: Tasmania
Gender: Male


Return to Between Bushwalks

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests