Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

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Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby the_camera_poser » Sun 17 Aug, 2008 9:39 pm

Despite my solemn oath otherwise, and since it does involve old growth forest, which involves walking, I'd love to know-

Is anyone going to the anti-mill protest in Launceston next weekend?
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby Chris » Sun 17 Aug, 2008 11:50 pm

I'd love to know- Is anyone going to the anti-mill protest in Launceston next weekend?


Absolutely!
Though it's actually officially a "Restore Democracy Rally"
Either way, well worth supporting IMO.

Will John Gay take the opportunity to announce that he now realises that we don't want the mill on the Tamar, and will take it elsewhere? After all, he did set a precedent with the proposed veneer mill at Western Junction (a more graceful admission would have been wonderful, but prob. a bit much to expect).

By the way, I had hoped profoundly that the veneer mill could have been supported, so that the impression that Greens etc never support anything could be combated. Unfortunately when the full details of the proposal were revealed it was going to be another ill-conceived shocker.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby the_camera_poser » Mon 18 Aug, 2008 8:14 pm

See you there Chris!
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby sthughes » Tue 19 Aug, 2008 3:25 pm

Though it's actually officially a "Restore Democracy Rally"


Can't people separate the two things? I think the Pulp Mill process was at best "shonky" - but I really just can't see that that is a good reason to be against the mill. I mean Gunns is a business - if they can get their project off the ground like that well good for them, it's the politicians we should be annoyed with - not Gunns.
All the people I know who are against the mill are against it either because of the dodgy process or the old growth logging issue. To me both of these are separate issues and shouldn't stop the mill construction. I guess there are people against it for other perceived reasons but I'm yet to hear a good one relating to the mill itself

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Edit: Actually that's a bit off topic. The answer should have been - No I will not be attending. Perhaps if it was a "pulp mill assessment was a sham rally" or an "anti old growth logging" rally I might consider it. What it's actually a rally for doesn't matter because the Greens andd Wlderness Society will say that everyone there was against the pulp mill regardless of if they are or if they are actually there trying to "Restore Democracy".
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby walkinTas » Tue 19 Aug, 2008 5:19 pm

sthughes wrote:All the people I know who are against the mill are against it either because of the dodgy process or the old growth logging issue. To me both of these are separate issues and shouldn't stop the mill construction. I guess there are people against it for other perceived reasons but I'm yet to hear a good one relating to the mill itself.


I had my say on why I would support a pulp mill in another thread and why we need a timber industry. I fall in to the group who dislike the current proposal because it will use old growth forests. To fully support the proposal I would need to see it modified so that it did not require any old growth timber.

I won't be at your rally-for-the-sake-of-having-a-rally. If you start protesting to permanently stop logging of Tasmania's remain Virgin Forest, then I will join you. As I said before logging these forests is an opportunistic practice. Timber companies have the attitude of taking all the timber they can from these forests for as long as they can. They won't stop until someone tells them to stop. Sadly, by the time everyone work out what the real issues are, it will be too late.
Last edited by walkinTas on Tue 19 Aug, 2008 10:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby the_camera_poser » Tue 19 Aug, 2008 9:05 pm

I'm with you Walkin- I'd live with a pulp mill, if it was honestly and openly developed, but not one reliant on old growth forest. But this one does.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby corvus » Tue 19 Aug, 2008 9:39 pm

I wont be at the Rally because I don't trust the ethics of it we ARE a democracy and
WE the MAJORITY voted for the current Government ,sour grapes and Greeny rants don't count till next election and yes I think the Mill should be at Hampshire.
I keep reading and hearing that the Majority of Tassie are against the Mill DONT THINK SO but will be happy to be enlightened with hard fact :)
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby flyfisher » Tue 19 Aug, 2008 9:56 pm

Its nice to live in a country where people can protest peacefully without getting locked up or worse.
Good thing about this forum is that people who have differing opinions on many things can express that opinion without fear of punishment (other than a verbal clout around the ears).
If our ideas on certain matters are not in agreement with one another ,then we must be happy to agree to disagree.
This level of tolerance is a wonderfull thing to have as we are basicly like minded people seeking to enjoy our bush.

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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby Speculator » Wed 20 Aug, 2008 11:54 am

corvus wrote:and yes I think the Mill should be at Hampshire.


I tend to figure that near Burnie, or near Launceston are as good as one another really. I mean, a pulp mill is an ugly thing, and you'd be hard pressed to make Burnie or Lonnie look much uglier! :P

Seriously though. I think Tassie needs to get a grip. It's time to start a program of transitioning industry in Tasmania out of timber and into other strengths we have here. It's the only way we'll end the reliance on flattening our wilderness to make a buck.

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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby the_camera_poser » Wed 20 Aug, 2008 12:37 pm

I reckon the GM, certified organic industry will be a huge factor in the future economy, if it's fostered.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby Speculator » Wed 20 Aug, 2008 3:59 pm

the_camera_poser wrote:I reckon the GM, certified organic industry will be a huge factor in the future economy, if it's fostered.


See! In less than one day we've already got one idea, and relatively speaking, we're just a bunch of nobodys (if you'll excuse me for saying so). Surely the brains that run this state - or should run this state - can come up with plenty of ways to put Tassie on the map, rather than logging it off the map!
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby sthughes » Wed 20 Aug, 2008 4:23 pm

the_camera_poser wrote:I reckon the GM, certified organic industry will be a huge factor in the future economy, if it's fostered.


You mean Genetically Modified crops in Tassie are the future? or do you mean Crops certified as not GM?
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby tasadam » Mon 25 Aug, 2008 8:09 pm

OOOooohhh It's tempting. I clicked on Post Reply.
But I won't.




OK I will.
Gunns have said repeatedly that they will not use old growth timber in the pulp mill.
We all know that they are going to burn the old growth if they cannot sell it for chips, so they can plant their plantation timber for the mill, thus not use any old growth timber in the mill.
Let the future prove me wrong.
Better still, let the future have us die of old age wondering, without an environmentally damaging, non closed-loop mill with all the shonky politics that go with it.

Somewhere between 5000 (police and newspaper) and 10000 (Green bodies and rally organisers) people gave up a lovely sunny weekend day to attend. I'm sure many of them had better things they could have been doing.
I don't like to single out, but Corvus (we are in Controversy Corner, after all), yes we the majority voted for the gov't that is there now. Doesn't stop us from disagreeing with something they are doing or not doing.
Your argument might be the majority of people voted that way, so the majority want the mill. That is where we disagree. The election was about a government for the state, not about a mill.
I voted against the mill and against the gov't. One out of 2 wrong so far.

Was I at the rally? No.
Do I have a kitchen in my house at the moment? No.
Like me, many people who would have spent the time going to things like the rally, have things to do at the moment that are more important.

There's lots of entertaining reading on this site.
http://www.plugger.com.au/news/Gunns/

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Waiting for the floor varnish to dry.
Then I'll be absent again as I have been for the last number of weeks.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby corvus » Mon 25 Aug, 2008 9:18 pm

Just knew I could tempt a reply :) what percentage of the voting population is the( perhaps) 10000 then add those who were doing home renos or bush-walking or crook with the Lurgy, say take the total to 20000 what percentage is that.
Far short I suspect of the statement being bandied around that "the majority of Tasmanians don't want the mill"but I respect everyone's entitlement to protest that is what Democracy is all about and as I have stated on previous posts debate creates interest and life would be so boring without it.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby the_camera_poser » Mon 25 Aug, 2008 11:11 pm

ohhhhh polishing a floor. Yuck. you can keep that job. I'd rather spend the weekend between Bunnings and in the crawlspace under my house....
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby Joe » Tue 16 Sep, 2008 7:44 pm

hope its not an old growth wooden floor you are polishing? ;)

Seriously though the pulp mill is looking shakier and shakier each day...their failure to meet the last deadline for the compliance doovers after they themeselves fast tracked that section of the process illustrates the slapdash nature of the whole project. I am not against pulp mills...we need them...but this one scares me. Too much is happening under the table.
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Re: Wading into the Pulp Mill morass once again

Postby Speculator » Tue 16 Sep, 2008 9:55 pm

taswaterfalls.com wrote:hope its not an old growth wooden floor you are polishing? ;)

Seriously though the pulp mill is looking shakier and shakier each day...their failure to meet the last deadline for the compliance doovers after they themeselves fast tracked that section of the process illustrates the slapdash nature of the whole project. I am not against pulp mills...we need them...but this one scares me. Too much is happening under the table.


.... I hope it's not an old growth wooden table! :shock:

... it probably is though isn't it? :(
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