fuel stoves

[Chrisbulldog]

Does anyone else have an opinion as to whether Trangia type fuels stoves are the best for long trips and whether Jetboil type ones are best for 1 or 2 day trips?

[Franco]

Just some thoughts about this statement :
"To summarize the fuel stove debate ,is , as the salesman i spoke to suggested in Hobart, Trangia best for long trips and Jetboil type stoves best for 1to2 day trips ?"
The only characteristics that the two stove mentioned have in common is that they are a complete system : burner/pot/windscreen, are simple/ foolproof and work in windy conditions.
The Trangia is (INMH) ideal for people that want to do extensive cooking and don't like gas.
The JetBoil (JPS ) is for folk that are after a compact easy solution to mostly boil water .

Performance
Very roughly you need twice as much alcohol (in weight) than gas to boil the same amount of fuel.
On my scale the JPS with a 100g cartridge is 640g. That boils (conservatively) 10 L of water
The lightest Trangia* is the 27-1UL at 720 g, add 200g of metho and a container and your starting weight is 950g .
So even if you have a full cartridge and are out for a day only the Jetboil is lighter. However contrary to the advice from your salesman, having to carry twice as much fuel (in practice in cold weather is more than that...) the Trangia will always be heavier.

Having said that, those two are NOT lightweight solutions particularly for the boil water only brigade.
For example my Caldera Cone system has a total weight of 400g with 200g of metho. (550ml pot)
I can boil 500 ml of water with about 7ml of Ethanol, so about 14L with the 200ml.
If I go out for an overnighter my full kit is under 250g.

With gas, I have the very common Kovea Ti stove (sold under other brands) , that system with a 900ml pot and my around the pot windscreen (made from soft drink cans) can boil i L about as efficiently as the Jetboil even in windy conditions and is about 1/3 lighter.

Of course I don't fry, nor bake , nor attempt Cordon Blue cooking because I go out to enjoy nature not to practice my culinary skills.
* Yes I do know about the Mini Trangia, not particularly light nor efficient but "safe" if you are not prepared to research# into this.
# for example : http://www.bushwalking.org.au/FAQ/FAQ_Stoves.htm

Franco
BTW for the ones that wonder how people can use 60L backpacks for 4 to 7 days, make a mental comparison in volume between the CC or the 1 pot system compared to the Trangia. (the Jetboil is almost identical in size to the 1 L Nalgene bottle)


The shot of my gas combo is of an older prototype. It works well but only with the gas on low. In mild temperatures , the lower the setting the more efficient it becomes.
A newer version has holes punched around the bottom. Of course it is fragile and you need to make one every two or three trips but it costs nothing and is very light.

[scockburn]

I know heaps of walkers who will not use anything but the Trangia because of reliability and I've been tempted to do same but I keep coming back to the weight issue and the fact that I can get lighter weight and less spacious gear with the titanium gas head and small gas canister coupled with a small light bill /pot that everything fits into. Steve C

[Son of a Beach]

The Trangia is (INMH) ideal for people that want to do extensive cooking and don't like gas.
The JetBoil (JPS ) is for folk that are after a compact easy solution to mostly boil water .

Well put. I've never really considered the difference that much, but I think you've summed it up pretty well. They are both excellent systems (for their purpose), but neither are particularly light weight.

Of course I don't fry, nor bake , nor attempt Cordon Blue cooking because I go out to enjoy nature not to practice my culinary skills.

I do fry (stir-fry, pancakes, steak, eggs, bacon), and do more than just attempt (I hope) all sorts of great food while bushwalking (on some walks, not all). I go out to enjoy being out in nature, and great food makes it even more enjoyable (for me, that is; I understand it's not everybody's cup of tea - or glass of wine).

The only think I would add to the Trangia debate is that a Trangia with the gas conversion (instead of using metho) is the best bushwalking stove/cooking-kit I've used bar none. However, it is rather heavy compared to some. So if weight is more important to you than fresh food and fresh cooking, and you'd rather just take ultra-light weight food, and just use the stove to boil water, then you'd be better off getting something more light weight.

I like the all-in-one aspect of the Trangia (ie, several pots/kettle, windshield, burner, etc), but you can do all in one with any other kit with just a bare minimum of creativity (as I've done with my 250g version of my Trangia).

The Kovea stoves do look like a winner if you're after something small and light. If I didn't already have a Trangia with gas, I'd be considering these for walks where weight was more of a priority. However, I still need the Trangia for some walks to use with the large wok that I use when cooking for larger groups.

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Note that this topic has been moved to the 'Equipment' forum, and has also been merged with another topic which had similar origins.

[wobbly]

Hi

I use an old 3 person meths Trangia. Yes its somewhat bulky and heavy and I often make it heavier/bulkier by leaving behind the supplied pots and taking 1 or 2 bigger billies I've found that sit perfectly on the supports in the top shield.
Using a Trangia does mean we only need 1 stove for 4 of us and at times we have even used it to cook for 6. Yet only one person has to carry a stove and If I palm out the fuel and someone carries my share of the tent it all seems to even out. Really any stove with big billies will do this, in fact a MSR is probably better, its faster, lighter and burner has better control. If I didn't already have the Trangia I'd probably go with a Whisperlite.

The jetboil seems designed to cater for just one or maybe two people, probably mainly eating freeze dried meals (not that's there's anything wrong with that)

I can't see how the duration of the walk itself would make a diference. I reckon the choice should come down to the sort of walking and cooking you do. If you often walk alone or in groups where everyone caters individually go for the jetboil.

If you walk in groups and cook in groups, or would like to be able to do steaks and pancakes occassionally then go for something other than the jetboil.

If you do both sorts of walking then get a Jetboil and find a mate with a Trangia

cheers

[Franco]

Great. I like it when folk realise that their pet product is what they like not necessarily what everybody else MUST use, or else.
Particularly I dislike when (mostly experienced walkers) state that something does not work when it clearly does for someone else....
I certainly would not recommend my Caldera Cone 550 ml system to most walkers, but it works for me.
For some eating well is part and parcel of being out, and why not ? If you bump into me and have spare pancakes for breakfast or risotto with mushroom made from scratch for dinner, please invite me to share, I will not refuse it ( I usually have Parmesan with me, so don't worry about that) . A glass of wine with dinner would also be most welcome as it is a nip of brandy before bed (if it not below zero..)
However I don't want to carry the extra weight.
As Wobbly has stated, you can use the Trangia for four or six, at that point it could become "lightweight" . And maybe for 4-6 a Jetboil could come along for a quick cup of coffee in the morning or a cup of soup at lunchtime....
My "objection" was to the short-long term slot allocated by the salesman for the two stoves.
BTW you don't need to be young to embrace change. Recently I found out that a guy that recently purchased a Tarptent after reading some of my comments ( and studying my pics) is over 70 ! So to him I am a young man.
Franco

[corvus]

I own and have used Trangia with metho,gas and Optimus Expedition conversions , all were /are fantastic to use and I will continue to use for multi person trips however for solo or (non communal cooking) I love my 550mg Ti ultralite pot with lid coupled with one of my many gas burners (Kovea Ti is the flavour of the month) but I think that my Optimus Crux will be the burner of choice in future as my mates to whom I often lend it out to rave about its performance and weight

[Chrisbulldog]

Thankyou all for your thoughts on this subject.