Sanitarium "One Square Meal"

[Onestepmore]

Another new study and article
http://iphone.sciencealert.com.au/featu ... 676-2.html

[wayno]

thanks for that ( takes another couple of scoops of cookies and cream ice cream).

[LandSailor]

Just for those who might be interested...here's a doco done by an irish guy who went on a high-fat diet for a month.
He tracks and documents his health markers over the duration. His results are pretty much identical to what happened for me.
(The Australian cricket team doctor does a brief interview in there as well). The doco covers a few of the key concepts related to high-fat diets.
View it and make your own judgement as to the truth of it.

Cereal Killers (60 mins)

I think the movie is free to watch for the next couple of days after which you have to pay.

[geoskid]

Just for those who might be interested...here's a doco done by an irish guy who went on a high-fat diet for a month.
He tracks and documents his health markers over the duration. His results are pretty much identical to what happened for me.
(The Australian cricket team doctor does a brief interview in there as well). The doco covers a few of the key concepts related to high-fat diets.
View it and make your own judgement as to the truth of it.

Cereal Killers (60 mins)

I think the movie is free to watch for the next couple of days after which you have to pay.

That link takes you to Mercola.com

Yep, That's Joseph Mercola, well known for all the wrong reasons. He's a Quack, yep, there's a problem with his thinking (if you get my drift). RationalWiki have clocked him :

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Joseph_Mercola

[wayno]

i wouldnt entirely write off mercola. take him with a grain of salt but he's not always wrong, that rational wiki article is one sided... mercuty for instance thre are plenty of cases of people improving their health when they get rid of mercury fillings, naturopath friend of mine finds a correlation between peoples health and mercury fillings and mercury levels in their bodies.

[geoskid]

i wouldnt entirely write off mercola. take him with a grain of salt but he's not always wrong, that rational wiki article is one sided... mercuty for instance thre are plenty of cases of people improving their health when they get rid of mercury fillings, naturopath friend of mine finds a correlation between peoples health and mercury fillings and mercury levels in their bodies.

You can Wayno, any person that understands science and evidence does.

If someone wants information about anything Mercola dribbles about, they would be wise to source it from reputable sources.

[geoskid]

Not sure why you would hold a Naturopath as any sort of authority, Wayno.
It would be a real struggle to find one that respects evidence.

[wayno]

Not sure why you would hold a Naturopath as any sort of authority, Wayno.
It would be a real struggle to find one that respects evidence.

he gets scientific analysis done of peoples hair to prove how much mercury is in their system, he retests months after they get mercury removed from their teeth and the mercury levels have dropped.... and their health improved...
he isnt your average naturopath. he is also a trained physiotherapist. and he will use medical science as well..

[geoskid]

Not sure why you would hold a Naturopath as any sort of authority, Wayno.
It would be a real struggle to find one that respects evidence.

he gets scientific analysis done of peoples hair to prove how much mercury is in their system, he retests months after they get mercury removed from their teeth and the mercury levels have dropped.... and their health improved...
he isnt your average naturopath. he is also a trained physiotherapist. and he will use medical science as well..

Have you read about hair analysis Wayno. It has no scientific basis to be used that way.
Your average Naturopath holds beliefs that are not supported by evidence. Yours endorses Homeopathy. He's very average.

[wayno]

well what you've read may says its not good, my friend has had good results using it, i've used it, and its been a great help in showing me what to eat to improve my health. i used to have chronic fatigue, been through a plethora of treatments that did little or nothing for my health.. but this naturopath worked for me...

[geoskid]

well what you've read may says its not good, my friend has had good results using it, i've used it, and its been a great help in showing me what to eat to improve my health. i used to have chronic fatigue, been through a plethora of treatments that did little or nothing for my health.. but this naturopath worked for me...

No worries Wayno, you're a true believer.

Glad you got over chronic fatigue, but the truth is you don't know the causal relationships (if any) at play regarding that.

[wayno]

well what you've read may says its not good, my friend has had good results using it, i've used it, and its been a great help in showing me what to eat to improve my health. i used to have chronic fatigue, been through a plethora of treatments that did little or nothing for my health.. but this naturopath worked for me...

No worries Wayno, you're a true believer.

Glad you got over chronic fatigue, but the truth is you don't know the causal relationships (if any) at play regarding that.

i had several hair tests, my mineral levels in my body shifted significantly and that coincided with a rise in energy, the rise in energy happened long before i had the retests done.... i didnt notice much difference in the first dis months and the retest confirmed there wasnt a big shift, but another six months on both energy and mineral levels changed. and thats wht the naturopath finds with the rest of his patients....

[photohiker]

Last time I checked, removing amalgam fillings releases more mercury into your body than will leach out of them if you leave them there. Has this changed?

[wayno]

Last time I checked, removing amalgam fillings releases more mercury into your body than will leach out of them if you leave them there. Has this changed?

my understanding is dentists are supposed to use a dam in the mouth to reduce ingestion of the mercury when they remove the filings, thats what i had when i had mine removed...

[geoskid]

well what you've read may says its not good, my friend has had good results using it, i've used it, and its been a great help in showing me what to eat to improve my health. i used to have chronic fatigue, been through a plethora of treatments that did little or nothing for my health.. but this naturopath worked for me...

No worries Wayno, you're a true believer.

Glad you got over chronic fatigue, but the truth is you don't know the causal relationships (if any) at play regarding that.

i had several hair tests, my mineral levels in my body shifted significantly and that coincided with a rise in energy, the rise in energy happened long before i had the retests done.... i didnt notice much difference in the first dis months and the retest confirmed there wasnt a big shift, but another six months on both energy and mineral levels changed. and thats wht the naturopath finds with the rest of his patients....

Have a read of this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hair_analy ... e_medicine)

How would you satisfactorily explain the discrepancies between the results of different tests on the same hair samples.

The thing is, measuring the contents of hair is not measuring the contents of the rest of the body.
So this happenned (to you) over 12-18 months? What else happenned in that period?
The problem with belief that is not based on evidence, is you stop looking for real answers.

Nothing wrong with that if the false answers are not plastered all over the internet.

[wayno]

geoskid, i dont care what your angle is anymore , i'm convinced its worked for me, i have nothing more to say to you, troll on all you like.. i'm too busy

[geoskid]

geoskid, i dont care what your angle is anymore , i'm convinced its worked for me, i have nothing more to say to you, troll on all you like.. i'm too busy

No worries Wayno.
Trolls seek an emotional response - I seek a rational response. I see that's not going to happen.

[photohiker]

Last time I checked, removing amalgam fillings releases more mercury into your body than will leach out of them if you leave them there. Has this changed?

my understanding is dentists are supposed to use a dam in the mouth to reduce ingestion of the mercury when they remove the filings, thats what i had when i had mine removed...

Yes. There is some trouble with that idea. It does stop you ingesting most of the drilled out amalgam but it does nothing for the released vapour. You have to breathe during the procedure.

Have a read: http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRel ... rcury.html

[wayno]

question is, does leaving the fillings in lead to even more mercury ingestion in the long run than ingested removing them...

[Picaro]

Selenium is good for dealing with low levels of mercury. One will bind to the other, enabling safe passage, and you end up with a nice mercury plated stool for the pool room. Now, go eat some Brazil nuts ! ...Hmm. Are they called Brazil nuts because they don't have any hair on the nuts ?

[wayno]

iodine helps with mercury excretion... more people are lower in iodine now, bread used to be fortified with iodine, but today its fortified with bromine instead.... bromine reduces iodine absorption and also forces iodine out of the body....

[metastable]

iodine helps with mercury excretion... more people are lower in iodine now, bread used to be fortified with iodine, but today its fortified with bromine instead.... bromine reduces iodine absorption and also forces iodine out of the body....

Reference for this?

The Australia New Zealand Food Standards Code http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/code/Pages/default.aspx and specifically Australia New Zealand Food Standards Code - Standard 2.1.1 - Cereals and Cereal Products http://www.comlaw.gov.au/Series/F2008B00632 states the following:

(2) Wheat flour for making bread must contain –

(a) no less than 2 mg/kg and no more than 3 mg/kg of folic acid; and
(b) no less than 6.4 mg/kg of thiamin.


and further down

5 Mandatory addition of iodised salt to bread

(1) Subclause 1(2) of Standard 1.1.1 does not apply to this clause.

(2) Iodised salt must be used for making bread where salt would otherwise be used.

(3) Subclause (2) does not apply to:
Federal Register of Legislative Instruments F2014C00030As at 9 October 2009 3 Standard 2.1.1
(a) bread which is represented as organic;
(b) the addition of salt (for example rock salt) to the surface of bread; or
(c) the addition of other food containing salt during the making of bread.

Bromine isn't mentioned in that document at all

[phsculpture]

Last time I checked, removing amalgam fillings releases more mercury into your body than will leach out of them if you leave them there. Has this changed?

my understanding is dentists are supposed to use a dam in the mouth to reduce ingestion of the mercury when they remove the filings, thats what i had when i had mine removed...

Yes. There is some trouble with that idea. It does stop you ingesting most of the drilled out amalgam but it does nothing for the released vapour. You have to breathe during the procedure.

Have a read: http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRel ... rcury.html

I had this done a few years ago, 4 mercury fillings replaced. In addition to the dental dam, my dentist had a pretty serious targeted vacuum hovering over my mouth.

[wayno]

don't forget your other vacuum hovering over your wallet

[phsculpture]

NYU insurance was a beautiful thing.

[geoskid]

question is, does leaving the fillings in lead to even more mercury ingestion in the long run than ingested removing them...

No, It does'nt, and I really , really believe it, and you must respect my belief, or you will find yourself on the receiving end of my most severe pout and shrug.

[LandSailor]

That link takes you to Mercola.com
Yep, That's Joseph Mercola, well known for all the wrong reasons. He's a Quack, yep, there's a problem with his thinking (if you get my drift).

Well I dont know anything about Joseph Mercola. Ive never heard of him before. I dont think he had anything to do with making the actual movie, it is merely hosted on his web site.
He sounds like one of those people who likes to take a contrary view to everything. But with the absolute abysmal state of public health with regard to metabolic diseases maybe it is time to start challenging some assumptions?

Anyway if you want to proclaim "guilt by association" and stop there, that is up to you. The same ideas have also been covered by Time magazine, New York Times and Wall Street Journal, even the Australian cricket team have seen benefits from it. There are also many randomized controlled trials to support it as well.

Some other studies:-

Insufficient evidence (< or =2 criteria) of association (with heart disease) is present for intake of....saturated and polyunsaturated fatty acids;

The harmful effect of dietary s*&^%$#a (saturated fatty acids) and the protective effect of dietary PUFA on atherosclerosis and CVD are questioned.

A meta-analysis of prospective epidemiologic studies showed that there is no significant evidence for concluding that dietary saturated fat is associated with an increased risk of CHD or CVD.

Those progressive Swedes did a 2 year review of the literature and also agree.

It is this kind of research that leads to commentary like this from a practising cardiologist of 30 years. Maybe the American Heart Association whose current business model is based on selling tick logos should get an entry on quackwatch?

Any contrary evidence to the current nutritional dogma tends to be overlooked though I think due to the kind of attitudes seen on this forum. Is it critical thinking or simple narrow-mindedness/group-think? You be the judge.

Ive mentioned the movie here is because I personally think its legit and it mirrors my own personal experience in terms of positive health outcomes. And it gives some background on why some are sceptical of the standard nutritional advice. Anyway the movie is no longer available so I hope some people at least were able to form an opinion based on the content rather than a reflex attempt to discredit it.

Incidentally for anyone interested, if you want to get your LDL particle size tested you can get an LDL sub-fraction test done. This is a more detailed cholesterol test than the standard test.
With a referral from your GP it can be done by mainstream pathology labs and cost an extra $50 out of pocket (might want to confirm the cost beforehand though).

[wayno]

i wouldnt advocate a high fat diet either.... races that eat high fat diets can have big health problems in older age, inuits can be relatively healthy but have their health slide quickly in old age, possibly attributable to acidic diet high in protein and or fat. same with some traditional african races. , i'm not doing to cite evidence, i have read it in the past and dont have time to trawl for the citations a lot are down on paper...
fat is acidic, high amounts of it can be hard on your liver and kidney's ,
i say everything in moderation
there are plenty of races that eat a lot of refined carbs and have good health, look at asia.... there is more to is than just having a high carb or high fat diet i think...
in the west consumption of greens veges and fruit can be a lot lower than in places in asia that eat a lot of carbs and are still healthy, you have to look at someones complete diet and lifestyle to get a grasp on what is affecting their health stats

[LandSailor]

Dont disagree Wayno...it has been the relentless demonisation of fat that forces people onto high carb diet by default that is the problem.
If your short-term goal is to lose weight though, the evidence is fairly clear that a high-fat diet is the way to go. From my own personal experience this is true too.

[Strider]

Dont disagree Wayno...it has been the relentless demonisation of fat that forces people onto high carb diet by default that is the problem.
If your short-term goal is to lose weight though, the evidence is fairly clear that a high-fat diet is the way to go. From my own personal experience this is true too.

Can you define 'high-fat diet"? I can only eat so much bacon...