Low Carb Menu?

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Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Fri 15 Jun, 2018 1:13 pm

Any ideas for low carbohydrate menu items? (especially a bulk/staple alternative to pasta /rice).

At first glance, looks tricky, almost every item of traditional bushwalkers fare is out?
Pemmican? Jerky? Beef Mince & Broccoli? :)
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Orion » Fri 15 Jun, 2018 3:40 pm

I was just reading about low carb alternatives to rice, pasta, and flour. Apparently it's become a popular thing to use cauliflower, ground up finely, to imitate rice, or ground even more finely to use as flour in dough. And also zucchini and capsicum can apparently be cut into threads to substitute for noodles.

I've never bought or tried to make any of these myself. Although I personally have no problem metabolising carbohydrates and include large amounts in virtually every meal I find these alternatives interesting, something I'd like to try.

For bushwalking I would imagine one could dehydrate these vegetables and, hopefully, maintain a fair degree of whatever textural qualities they are capable of when fresh. I doubt that cauliflower has the same chewiness as rice. And there's just no way zucchini would every achieve that perfect al dente bite of a well made spaghetti. But it might be close enough, good enough. And perhaps interesting in its own right.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby gayet » Fri 15 Jun, 2018 4:24 pm

Zucchini, finely sliced into spaghetti like strips and dehydrated works well for bushwalking. I have done so although I used it as a veg rather than a pasta substitute. I also use it undehydrated at home. Carrot can be similarly treated. The cauliflower 'rice' , with the flower head (not the stems) broken into small pieces rather than finely ground is recent 'must try' in various food related magazines that I have seen. I don't like cauli in any form so I'll leave that one. Chargrilled, deskinned and dehyd'd capsicum is very good. Comes back to life well but is also very nice in its dehy state as something to nibble on.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby CasualNerd » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 12:02 am

I find low carb easiest if you avoid cooked meals, and just snack - cheese (soft mould cheeses, babybel, laughing cow, or kraft shelf stable cheddar), nuts, salami, avocado, even a tin of spam. When you want something hot a cuppa soup. Cauliflower rice is the lchf staple carb replacement because it dehydrates easily. The standard smoked cabana from the supermarket lasts ages without refrigeration, and you can hang it at home to dry it further before walking to save a bit of weight. There's a lot more freeze dried veg becoming available too, even green beans !

If you're ketogenic / fat adapted then you might find you don't need to eat as much as usual as your body just burns body fat... I find that when bushwalking I forget to eat which makes things very simple. In my personal experience if you're typically low carb at home you can also get away with extra carbs when bushwalking.

There are a growing number of athletes going keto so search facebook for groups like 'fat adapted athlete' and 'ketogenic backpackers'
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby ribuck » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 4:28 am

I deleted the carb from my bushwalking lunches, and it made the lunch simpler and tastier. No more worrying about how to stop the crackers or flatbreads from crumbling to pieces in my pack. Just salmon, olives, cheese, biltong, nuts...

(I still eat carbs at other times when bushwalking, especially chocolate. I know that the carbs are being used as energy and not being stored as fat. Back in the city I need to go easy on these again.)
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Hiking Noob » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 9:01 am

If you process Cauli would that change the GI rating? Surely having a food ground to a pulp would make it digest a lot more quickly and leave you hungry in a shorter period of time? For that reason I find porridge completely useless as a food and have rolled oats type muesli instead, keeps me full for at least twice as long.

The OT was the only walk I have done and I didn't eat as much as I would in a normal day, I finished with over a kilo of food spare and barely dropped a kilo of body weight in the five days.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby CasualNerd » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 10:08 am

Hiking Noob wrote:If you process Cauli would that change the GI rating?

Cauliflower is very low carb anyway, so you wouldn't need to worry.

GI is a mostly *&^%$#! IMHO, you can now get low carb pure sugar !
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Orion » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 11:55 am

I bought a cauliflower today with the intent to try cauliflower rice. I've been googling and reading but I believe (sort of) in the near-infinite wisdom of bushwalk.com. So I would love to hear some suggestions for how to go about preparing it. I'm interested in it both from a fresh use perspective as well as dehydrated/rehydrated.

Any tips?
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby CasualNerd » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 12:51 pm

Orion wrote:I bought a cauliflower today with the intent to try cauliflower rice.

Most people roughly chop it, blitz it in a food processor till it's about the size of large rice grains, then cook it something like a stirfry or a dry risotto. You can microwave it too, which probably works best if you like no fuss cooking.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Sat 16 Jun, 2018 5:03 pm

Good tips on Zucchini /shredded veg and Cauli, i'll be considering both, thanks.

Iv'e been trying a bunch of ideas with Coconut flour and understand there's a no-carb noodle or flour to make.
It's mainly for main meals but breakfast and deserts/ drinks also. Some commercial options (of very few) iv'e tried are awful (ie almond spread) and others are similar but not the same (Coco pancakes are nice but of oddly 'mealy' texture). I found low carb tortillas but they are still 11g's each so not really much better than a slice of bread (carbs wize).

CasualNerd wrote:
There are a growing number of athletes going keto so search facebook for groups like 'fat adapted athlete' and 'ketogenic backpackers'


Thanks , i'll check this out too. I'm not sure we can get low carbs enough to satisfy ketosis level diets but just 'low-carb' will be a good start.

Orion. Good luck, maybe broccoli as well? Broc-cauli rice :)
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 1:43 pm

The mention of 'spaghetti veg' brought back an old memory.. Spaghetti Squash.. Low carb as well. Though I haven't seen one for 35+yrs.

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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Son of a Beach » Mon 18 Jun, 2018 10:39 am

My wife is low carb and aims for keto.

When we go bushwalking, she just eats the same food as everyone else, but without the carb component. It's very simple if your meals are assembled from components at cooking time (and not already all mixed together). Eg, if we're having spag-bog, she has the bog without the spag. If we're having wraps, she has all the bits that we put in the wraps, but in a bowl with a fork or spoon, instead of in a wrap. (This is the same as how she does it at home or when visiting other people's homes.)

For breakfast (which is 90% carbs for many people) she'll have a boiled egg (which is not entirely carb-free), or bacon, or both, or a coffee with cream.

If she thinks she needs energy food, she eats cheese or salami or something else high-fat.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Tue 19 Jun, 2018 11:30 am

I like the idea of just simply leaving out the carbs. Bushwalking menus are always so much more satisfying to eat than describe (with exceptions.. eg. a bacon / egg breaky).

One of our walkers, a few years back, brought along a big butter cube and some tinned meats, and would put a some/a slice in place of the many carbs. She had done this rather than even mention low-carbs diet (until the last days).
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Son of a Beach » Tue 19 Jun, 2018 11:56 am

Nuts wrote:One of our walkers, a few years back, brought along a big butter cube and some tinned meats, and would put a some/a slice in place of the many carbs. She had done this rather than even mention low-carbs diet (until the last days).


She must be reading the same books/sites/podcasts/videos as my wife (which appear to be mostly credible from what I hear second-hand, with a few odd ideas thrown in here and there). My missus will often add slabs of butter on top of some meals (and has lost some considerable weight since switching to that kind of lifestyle).

The idea is that even though fats are very high in energy, they actually fill you up as well as take a long time for the body to process. Whereas carbs (especially sugars) can actually make you more hungry, and the body processes them very quickly. This certainly fits my experience, and I'm all for it. I love generous helpings of cream and butter, but I can only eat so much before I feel 'full'.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby CasualNerd » Tue 19 Jun, 2018 12:13 pm

Son of a Beach wrote:The idea is that even though fats are very high in energy, they actually fill you up as well as take a long time for the body to process. Whereas carbs (especially sugars) can actually make you more hungry, and the body processes them very quickly. This certainly fits my experience, and I'm all for it. I love generous helpings of cream and butter, but I can only eat so much before I feel 'full'.

There's a lot more to the science - for a lot of people it fixes their insulin resistance / diabetic issues and evens out their energy levels. Having 'unlimited' energy without eating is pretty useful as a bushwalker :D

I think over the next few years we'll see much more evidence produced as it's studied further.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Son of a Beach » Tue 19 Jun, 2018 2:36 pm

CasualNerd wrote:
Son of a Beach wrote:The idea is that even though fats are very high in energy, they actually fill you up as well as take a long time for the body to process. Whereas carbs (especially sugars) can actually make you more hungry, and the body processes them very quickly. This certainly fits my experience, and I'm all for it. I love generous helpings of cream and butter, but I can only eat so much before I feel 'full'.

There's a lot more to the science - for a lot of people it fixes their insulin resistance / diabetic issues and evens out their energy levels. Having 'unlimited' energy without eating is pretty useful as a bushwalker :D

I think over the next few years we'll see much more evidence produced as it's studied further.


Yes, so my wife keeps telling me (and anybody else that will stand still long enough to listen). But my main interest in it all is that now I get to eat some of the food I enjoy with a few less people telling me it's unhealthy. :-)
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Tue 19 Jun, 2018 3:51 pm

haha, no ofence, but I was gonna suggest you don't/didn't look like you need a diet... seefood perhaps.. :)
Time is a wonderful thing, wait long enough and an agreeable diet comes along..


(some resources)
http://skunkapeblog.com/low-carb-hiking/
https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb-bac ... sis-hunger
https://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-trail-food/
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Orion » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 11:24 am

So I grated the cauliflower, microwaved it for a few minutes and then dehydrated it. Once dry I added a bit of boiling water to a small sample.

It doesn't taste like rice, it tastes like cauliflower. It doesn't have the texture of rice, it has the texture of cauliflower. It's not rice. But it might serve as a base for a topping that would normally go over rice. That's something I haven't tried. I can't quite imagine a green Thai curry over the cauliflower bits. Maybe it would work. Maybe not.

I noticed our local Trader Joes store actually carries both cauliflower rice and broccoli rice in 1 lb bags. It's not very expensive. I also came across a spaghetti squash, something I haven't bothered to eat in a number of years. I bought one and baked it and I was quickly reminded why I hadn't been buying them -- I don't like the way they taste! I dehydrated it anyway and found that in it's dry state it's not a bad snack; kind of sweet. Rehydrated it returns to it's former self, more or less. It's definitely not pasta.

So I'm left thinking that the cauliflower bits are worthwhile. It's easy to dehydrate and rehydrate, it retains a decent texture, and it tastes okay. Nobody who isn't drunk is going to confuse it with rice but it could be substitute or sorts. A bit like carob is for chocolate, postum for coffee, or TVP for meat.

I'm glad that my body can deal with rice and pasta in abundance. And meat sometimes too. Woe to the vegetarian who seeks out faux meat substitutes. Vegetarian food can be so wonderful on its own. If for some reason I decided to pursue a low carbohydrate diet I think I would embrace it rather than attempt to make it look like a more balanced diet.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Son of a Beach » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 11:51 am

Agreed. I've tried cauliflower 'rice' and various meat substitutes (under duress, not by choice), and I reckon that if people want to stop eating rice, they should just stop eating it and don't try to replace it. Nothing else is quite like it and that's fine. Accept it and move on. Embrace your choice. Even more so for vegetarians. If they really dislike the idea of eating meat so much, then embrace what's left for what it is. Don't try to make meat substitutes. It's a pointless exercise. Especially if it means replacing real food with processed food.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby north-north-west » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 2:15 pm

Son of a Beach wrote:...and I reckon that if people want to stop eating rice, they should just stop eating it and don't try to replace it.

I don't like rice (a little brown and wild mix is OK, but only once in a blue moon) so I don't eat it. If I want bulky carbs with a meal I'll do noodles, pasta or potato. Like you, I don't see the point of trying to find something that is rice-ish without being rice.

I am a long way over listening to anyone else's diet preferences. There is no one diet/exercise regimen that suits everybody. Find what works for your body, and use it.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 2:20 pm

Interesting thoughts Orion. Looks like I might have to actually grow one to try spag squash again. Maybe it would make a better noodle substitute (thought pattern)

I'm always thinking in terms of substitutes, but for personal use, agreed. I would probably rely on snacking (as CN mentioned) so forming more traditional cooked meals / to fit with what everyone else is eating, is a bit of a challenge. As for what vego's or dieters want to eat or make look like something else, is all good, each to their own...I'd probably prefer a meat looking object if a reformed vego, hard to say.. : )

PS. At the mention of microwave. Been finding they actually dehydrate some items quite well,, super fast, on defrost (and with careful timing).
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Orion » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 3:15 pm

Very careful timing, I'd imagine. I've tried in the past and found it too easy to reach the smoking stage. But for the brief steaming of veggies prior to placing in a regular dehydrator, a microwave works very well.

I was kind of hoping that the cauliflower rice would work as a base for a green chili and beans recipe that I often make. I've got a couple dinners prepared right now for an upcoming trip. Usually we do it with rice but rice can be complicated. It takes a while, it can be sticky in the pot, and the chili and beans each need a bit of prep time as well. It's a bit of a juggle with just one pot. So I thought this cauliflower thing might be the ticket. But at the moment I'm thinking we'll go with tortillas instead.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Warin » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 3:47 pm

Nuts wrote:PS. At the mention of microwave. Been finding they actually dehydrate some items quite well,, super fast, on defrost (and with careful timing).


Ehh ...? My microwave has a defrost function? .. Oh it does .. 'Weight Defrost' what ever that means .. I'll have to try that.

I find vegies cooked in the microwave to be better than oven/stove top. I like most of them on the cruchie side.
For dehydrating broccoli I 'cook' them first in the microwave - 2 mins on high, then into the dehydrator.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby gayet » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 3:52 pm

If you like rice, cook extra at home next time and dehydrate it. It returns well and with less fuss than cooking in the field. Dehydrate a variety of rices (short, long, white, brown, black, red) and you have a variety of meals, both in look and taste - helps to cook it in something more interesting than just salted water first though ....
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby ribuck » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 4:10 pm

Orion wrote:I was kind of hoping that the cauliflower rice would work as a base for a green chili and beans recipe that I often make.

Why not simply omit the rice and make more of the chili and beans?

That's what my wife and I do at home - replace all our white carbs by more of everything else. We do three chili dishes that all taste great without the rice. The only downside is that the meal costs more.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Lamont » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 7:00 pm

"Two-thirds of Australians are overweight or obese and the prevalence of type 2 diabetes is rising at an alarming rate. We undertook one of the largest and most complex diet and lifestyle intervention studies in Australia and in 2017 used the data to create the CSIRO Low-Carb Diet to help Aussies (sic) battling this disease.
Rigorous scientific evidence shows our nutritionally balanced diet is not only effective in promoting substantial long-term weight loss but it also helps to improve blood glucose control and blood cholesterol profile (this is really important for treating insulin resistance, metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes!)."

Was reading this y'day then came across this thread. My mother was on this diet 30 years ago when she developed type 2 diabetes.
Empirical evidence is clearly supportive.
Much more here if you haven't seen it yet. And some killer recipes!! :D
https://blog.csiro.au/damn-thats-delici ... -cook-ups/
I think I thought I saw you try.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Nuts » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 7:46 pm

It's not hard at all to get to < 100g's a day for most people it seems. I'd expect this is considered 'low' carb? So an open sandwich or a few spoons of the favourite muesli, heavy with yogurt and berries :)

Warin wrote:
Nuts wrote:PS. At the mention of microwave. Been finding they actually dehydrate some items quite well,, super fast, on defrost (and with careful timing).


Ehh ...? My microwave has a defrost function? .. Oh it does .. 'Weight Defrost' what ever that means .. I'll have to try that.


The one i'm using is timed, and takes from around 8- 10mins, i'd watch and check by the minute. I tried mushroom slices and, almost ready, they started to self combust in little bursts of flame ..
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Warin » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 7:57 pm

Warin wrote:
Nuts wrote:PS. At the mention of microwave. Been finding they actually dehydrate some items quite well,, super fast, on defrost (and with careful timing).


Ehh ...? My microwave has a defrost function? .. Oh it does .. 'Weight Defrost' what ever that means .. I'll have to try that.


The one i'm using is timed, and takes from 10mins, i'd watch and check by the minute. I tried mushroom slices and, almost ready, they started to self combust in little bursts of flame ..[/quote]

A paper I read something like 10 or was it 5 .. times the normal cooking time was required to combust food in a microwave. I'd reduce that cooking time by a factor of at least 5 and taste it then. It was a microwave journal ... not something normal people read... :oops:
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby ribuck » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 9:19 pm

Lamont wrote:Much more here if you haven't seen it yet. And some killer recipes!! :D
https://blog.csiro.au/damn-thats-delici ... -cook-ups/

Thanks Lamont, I hadn't seen that book. Straight away I bought the Kindle version and will try some of these recipes. They all look super-tasty even if a bit spartan.
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Re: Low Carb Menu?

Postby Lamont » Wed 20 Jun, 2018 9:43 pm

No worries, got to love the CSIRO.
What about the diet regimen they will sell you for which you will be full re-imbursed at the end!!
If this isn't a good use of our taxes what is?
No crappy Weight Watchers scheme there.
I think I thought I saw you try.
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