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Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 29 Jun, 2017 1:07 pm
by Nuts
They could always go outside..



It irks me to look at the project team and suspect yet another 'loudest voice in the room' of getting their way.

I don't mind the aspects of the plan that promote less impact and use the existing damaged ground, an efficient transport system and why not set it up for a cable car, an attraction in itself (less sure at the point it crosses into WHA but ok..) Always thought a safe bike path would be a positive upgrade. The need for a new VC is fair enough, I guess. Was at the Yellowstone village VC last year, it was such an affront after spending nights camping in the wilds, but (I came to think) more than necessary to manage people in bulk, in a manner to which they are accustomed.

(The village is 90% private enterprise and there's talk of privatising the park itself)...

So, on the other front:

It is a clear choice to make it so, 'bulk' is not a necessity, especially within parks. Encourage another Mona style juggernaut, take accolades from that, call it done?

At CM, Far more convenient to just close the road to private traffic. Could easily operate that road system on a one way basis, in on the half hour / out on the half hour, if an immediate efficiency upgrade was desired (another notion of another pesky local but welcome to it).

Experience shows, from observations of the private providers at Cradle Mt (and out in the park), that the power is wielded by them, and this will be no different. Hardly attract a private CC developer without the promise of exclusive profit making opportunity, enhanced by a closed road. And then there's pressure from the other private enterprise they manage to attract, or that grows around the poor parks benefactor. It will only increase, notwithstanding who these people are (if they happen to be rellies and friends). And every small excused effect can be equally applied within the WHA, and a sliding set of values out behind the hills. The pressure will increase on a poorly funded park service diminished further as a marketing instrument to tourism.

We have already, in a few short years, seen the evolution go from a bad move of a former notorious environment-ambivalent government (the old peer-group-mindset) to an aspiration of budding outdoor industry, with a flimsy set of adopted values that include development as being ok/ accepted/ innocuous.. or just an industry built around "I need a job & don't give a damn.." Big happy family/morals set by peer pressure. Smart kids, brains washed.

anyhow..

What are the changes planned at Waldheim? (bit vague on that)

The pre-closing rush each morning is definitely a possibility. Looks like the public access will be as far as Ronny Creek HW.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 19 Jul, 2017 9:46 am
by gayet

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 19 Jul, 2017 11:26 pm
by TheNW
Ive not spent any time in the area or walked it but going on the articles ive read maybe theres a silver lining with the village idea in that it could keep more visitors out of the rest of the area? I cant for the life of me figure out why they need a viewing window when you can just step outside and look tho ... amazing what people are happy to spend money on when its not their money

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Tue 13 Feb, 2018 11:56 am
by gayet

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 16 May, 2018 3:18 pm
by Nuts
'Malcolm Turnbull rocking Cradle Mountain with $30 million for cable-way '


https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/54 ... cable-way/

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 16 May, 2018 3:33 pm
by potato
Really!? I cannot not believe what I have just read.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 16 May, 2018 4:00 pm
by Nuts
Disbelief is a good place to start :)
Personally, development at Cradle Mt is inevitable, and a transport solution is needed.
But there is still plenty of odour.. announced by a candidate.. with a bi-election looming..
A discount for locals, implies a mandatory new cost..
Moreso, what to do with the churned hordes, 'hundreds of thousands', best just a fly-by at Dove Lk. and theme park back at the 'gateway precinct'... but I doubt they'll stop there.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 16 May, 2018 6:13 pm
by Warin
o Hummm a cable way all the way from Dove Lake to Lake St Clair south .... I can see it now... $$$$

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 9:41 am
by potato
Upgrading the road to accommodate more traffic was always the sensible solution. The bus system was never really going to work - it is so poorly executed

Seems like the interests wanted to make a problem.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 12:43 pm
by Nuts
A cableway to LSC, it could be argued as an environmentally sensitive option, by the same measure private huts and heli landings and small V large nuclear explosions may be.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 1:36 pm
by potato
It's Disneyland Australia (formerly know as the Tasmanian Wilderness World Heritage Area)

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 2:44 pm
by Son of a Beach
potato wrote:Upgrading the road to accommodate more traffic was always the sensible solution. The bus system was never really going to work - it is so poorly executed

Seems like the interests wanted to make a problem.


I think the main issue with choosing shuttle buses over upgrading the road, is to avoid the need for increasing the size of the Dove Lake car park 10 fold. Yes, you could improve the road to make vehicular access safer and easier, and do away with the shuttle bus, but the car park would need to be MASSIVE to accommodate this. Even as it is, the car park is often chock-a-block full with cars parked well down the road, and every shuttle bus near full every 10 minutes.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 3:20 pm
by potato
Son of a Beach wrote:
I think the main issue with choosing shuttle buses over upgrading the road, is to avoid the need for increasing the size of the Dove Lake car park 10 fold. Yes, you could improve the road to make vehicular access safer and easier, and do away with the shuttle bus, but the car park would need to be MASSIVE to accommodate this. Even as it is, the car park is often chock-a-block full with cars parked well down the road, and every shuttle bus near full every 10 minutes.


I understand that completely - and it would be more of a eyesore from those looking down at the area from Marion's, helicopters etc. But once parks had made the decision to go the shuttle bus option, I never understood why private vehicles were allowed in the Dove Lake carpark without a very good reason.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 4:56 pm
by north-north-west
Son of a Beach wrote:
potato wrote:Upgrading the road to accommodate more traffic was always the sensible solution. The bus system was never really going to work - it is so poorly executed

Seems like the interests wanted to make a problem.

I think the main issue with choosing shuttle buses over upgrading the road, is to avoid the need for increasing the size of the Dove Lake car park 10 fold. Yes, you could improve the road to make vehicular access safer and easier, and do away with the shuttle bus, but the car park would need to be MASSIVE to accommodate this. Even as it is, the car park is often chock-a-block full with cars parked well down the road, and every shuttle bus near full every 10 minutes.

So you go for an underground carpark . . . Which would cost even more to build and probably be even more difficult to maintain.

We have to either limit numbers or provide better access. A subway style train would cost a lot more to build and be less attractive to the hordes, but less obtrusive. Workable?

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 17 May, 2018 6:02 pm
by Nuts
That's a good question potato, numbers are limited by the boom gate, but why still have day-time private cars? I'm sure locals appreciate being able to have their car so as to return after dark when the buses stop. But how to sift good reasons from not- good?

I'd like to see permit access to limited/graded tracks (like ski runs)... or at least access on two levels. The cheaper permit option (at Cradle Mt.) just including Dove Lake immediate surrounds and the DL circuit... the green run. A short session/head check with a ranger for a permit to climb anywhere higher.. so so for other parks where economics are becoming the overriding planning component. I think this would show appropriate respect to the (real) concept of environmental sensitivity by limiting visitor impact on more fragile places. Those places that just can't take 'hundreds of thousands'.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jul, 2018 4:36 pm
by michael_p
Just a side issue but still interesting: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-04/m ... 93121053=1

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2018 5:33 pm
by Nuts
Dirty tricks V's dirty tricks.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 1:14 pm
by Nuts
A few more details/ the Dove Lk refuge

Screen Shot 2018-09-08 at 1.03.50 pm.png
Screen Shot 2018-09-08 at 1.03.50 pm.png (603.35 KiB) Viewed 5152 times


https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/56 ... -revealed/

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 3:24 pm
by tastrax

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 3:26 pm
by north-north-west
And that's their idea of environmentally sensitive, blending into the surrounds, and all the rest of the *&^%$#!?

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 3:39 pm
by Warin
north-north-west wrote:their idea of environmentally sensitive, blending into the surrounds


Well it does not look like red brick with an orange roof that thrusts it self sky wards.

An alternative? Put the car park underground with the building on top .. could even have the floor of the building lower than the ground .. but windows view the surrounds. Of course while it is being build will be a nightmare for all. The colours and shape look to be ok to me.. what colours and shape would you prefer (other than not having it at all)?

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 3:57 pm
by north-north-west
Thick turf over the top so the native vegetation grows on it and hides it.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 4:22 pm
by Nuts
A bit more extensive than the original plan.

Screen Shot 2018-09-08 at 4.03.06 pm.png
Screen Shot 2018-09-08 at 4.03.06 pm.png (167.31 KiB) Viewed 5124 times

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Sat 08 Sep, 2018 5:05 pm
by Warin
Typical...
When building .. there is no provision for the workers to park their cars on/near site .. even if they only need to access their lunch box. :?
And certainly none for any building deliveries. :(

------------------
Looks like parking will be further up the road .. and less of it.

Re: Cradle Mountain Master Plan

PostPosted: Thu 13 Sep, 2018 6:14 pm
by weetbix456
Looking "iconic" & another fine example of "eco-tourism" doing what "the majority of people" want :lol: ... no seriously - what happened to the original turfed roof idea?? This is completely different to what I saw previously. Geez - I had even almost come to accept their *&%$#! cable car!!