KNP track comments sought

NSW & ACT specific bushwalking discussion.
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KNP track comments sought

Postby Lophophaps » Tue 05 Mar, 2019 8:58 pm

https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topi ... s-strategy

I became aware of this a few hours ago. There's not much time left for submissions.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby crollsurf » Tue 05 Mar, 2019 9:32 pm

Overall I'm Ok with it. Illawong to Charlottes I'm not so keen on but makes sense in the context of the AAWT

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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby potato » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 10:01 am

Good to see they are still pushing back on the mtb lobby and other walking track cutting ideas. Illawong to Charlottes... interesting. It isn't such a hard walk as it is. Does the same logic apply to the Rolling Grounds?

I don't why they want Great Walk status... more people, more pressure... a more degraded environment.

At least they aren't yet proposing to further zone off bits for developers.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Zapruda » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 10:49 am

Does anyone have any details on where the track might actually go?

As for Charlotte Pass to Guthega, I am hoping they don't go over Twynam and just run the track along the Snowy or Spencers. That area north of Twynam is way too nice to share.

I am against this “Great Walk”. This is just pork barreling. F**ck the environment and the landscape, all hail Vail, the ski resorts and their wads of cash... Sad times.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby north-north-west » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:14 pm

Zapruda wrote:Does anyone have any details on where the track might actually go?

As for Charlotte Pass to Guthega, I am hoping they don't go over Twynam and just run the track along the Snowy or Spencers. That area north of Twynam is way too nice to share.


The Draft Plan says along Guthrie Ridge to connect with the Illawong track. No details of how to get it from Guthega to GPS, but I like the Charlottes-Guthhrie-Illawong idea. Keeps the hordes off Twynam and the Rolling Grounds, but gives a decent alternative to the road walk for the AAWT. It's about time the dubbers got serious about that.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby north-north-west » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:25 pm

Zapruda wrote:Does anyone have any details on where the track might actually go?


Projected route is on p23 of the plan.

SIGWT.jpeg


I've walked that line between Guthega and Perisher. It's good country, variable and interesting with some great views. But there is some very delicate boggy ground that needs to be either avoided or built over. I think that's what they mean by the "environmental constraints" in the approach to Guthega.
Last edited by north-north-west on Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby north-north-west » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:32 pm

There is some interesting material in that. They can't turn Hannels into a major walking track because it's in the wilderness zone, but they do recognise the need for proper marking of the route and even regular pruning of vegetation to keep it clear.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Zapruda » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:33 pm

Thanks NNW. This makes me a little happier. There will of course be overflow into the lower Pounds / Twynam creek area via Illawong bridge but most will just continue on with Guthega so close by.

The section down to Crackenback will be interesting.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Zapruda » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 12:39 pm

north-north-west wrote:There is some interesting material in that. They can't turn Hannels into a major walking track because it's in the wilderness zone, but they do recognise the need for proper marking of the route and even regular pruning of vegetation to keep it clear.


When myself and others met with NPWS last year about getting the old Strawberry Hill trail that runs over Strumbo hill recut they were very against signage in wilderness areas. No matter how small and discreet. Interesting how they pick and choose. The new cutting (April 18) on Hannels spur does cease right on the boundary of the Western Fall wilderness from memory.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby potato » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 1:09 pm

Zapruda wrote:
north-north-west wrote:There is some interesting material in that. They can't turn Hannels into a major walking track because it's in the wilderness zone, but they do recognise the need for proper marking of the route and even regular pruning of vegetation to keep it clear.


When myself and others met with NPWS last year about getting the old Strawberry Hill trail that runs over Strumbo hill recut they were very against signage in wilderness areas. No matter how small and discreet. Interesting how they pick and choose. The new cutting (April 18) on Hannels spur does cease right on the boundary of the Western Fall wilderness from memory.


There is money to be made closer to the resorts.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Zapruda » Wed 06 Mar, 2019 1:39 pm

potato wrote:There is money to be made closer to the resorts.


The worry is the inevitable expansion of the resorts within their leases. Thredbo is dead set on having the highest everything they can possibly build. Their highest bell in Australia was of particular annoyance to me. Their Saturday night fireworks during the ski season might turn into a weekly occurrence year round. You can hear them from Teddys hut.

Perisher also doesn't think they have any responsibility in the park bar their own lease. This was evident when they wouldn't clean rubbish that flowed downstream this year after the snow melted and ski season ended. NPWS had to organise volunteer work parties to clean all the garbage from the creeks and surrounding areas.

Alpine and subalpine areas in Australia account for only a miniscule portion of the landmass. We are already allowing another Snowy Hyrdo project as well as letting the feral horses do their damage. Why add more strain?

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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby climberman » Thu 07 Mar, 2019 5:05 pm

Zapruda wrote:Does anyone have any details on where the track might actually go?

As for Charlotte Pass to Guthega, I am hoping they don't go over Twynam and just run the track along the Snowy or Spencers. That area north of Twynam is way too nice to share.

I am against this “Great Walk”. This is just pork barreling. F**ck the environment and the landscape, all hail Vail, the ski resorts and their wads of cash... Sad times.

I dunno if it really fits the definition of Pork barreling, but it is certainly specifically designed to encourage visitation, and visitation which can be incorporated with commercial ventures (guiding, transport support, etc, etc) so as to assist local regional economies.

NPWS have a broad state-wide program of related projects and approaches.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Nuts » Thu 07 Mar, 2019 6:13 pm

'Iconic' a.k.a

The track will be, by media hook and #yetanothercrook, secondary to a desire for exclusive private accommodation.

And then, of course, a permit system will be needed to control the hordes of irritating underclass.
And fees to pay.. in that country, all those loss prevention officers (rangers) necessary to remove undesirables/ citizens who thought wilderness was public space*... between performing menial tasks such as interpreting long lost frogs and fussing over poo patrol.. (poo, which btw ime all looks the same).

*Including bushwalkers left holding quaint old virtues of a new track in their mind.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby potato » Fri 08 Mar, 2019 7:30 am

climberman wrote:
NPWS have a broad state-wide program of related projects and approaches.


Indeed, just look at their instagram. Its all about experiences and little about the more important conservation work done by the everyday ranger.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby climberman » Fri 08 Mar, 2019 7:54 am

Well yes the everyday ranger is not widely celebrated. Not sure this is a new shift though. Pretty much par for the course.

I've no problem with increased and improved visitor experiences in the State's second-busiest NP.

nuts, yes, the route is designed to tie in with existing accommodation options, or camping areas. There are a range of accom options available. Whacking 'exclusive' in front of things is hyperbole at best. 'Hordes or irritating underclass' - for *&^%$# sake get a grip. If you are such an important amazing bushwalker I guess you would be off in the true wilds somewhere where you won't see any of these irritating members of the public.

Christ bushwalkers can be a mob of elitist wankers at times.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Nuts » Fri 08 Mar, 2019 10:02 am

Precious maybe. If anything anti-elitist. We aren't talking about necessary visitor services, mostly for the crowd sourced, for which new tracks are being marketed. Nothing to do with defending bushwalkers, I don't accept that wilderness/the true wilds are somewhere else, but imagine some rezoning and some hyperbole about catering for everyone, will make it that way.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby rcaffin » Sun 10 Mar, 2019 12:00 pm

the route is designed to tie in with existing accommodation options
Do tell: WHAT options?
From memory, leaving Charlottes Pass in a clockwise direction, the accommodation options are Seamans Hut (cleverly designed to prevent you from sleeping inside it), Rawsons Pass toilets (really?), then Illawong Lodge - which was a locked private ski club last I was there. Unless a whole lot of chalets have sprung up in the last year or two?

The alternative to a track along the Snowy from the Illawong bridge to Charlottes would be to follow the pole line from Guthega dam to the Paralyser/Perisher saddle and then down to Betts Camp. Longer, but maybe more interesting? OR, chuckle, you could try to go up Spencers Ck ... (which IS said in jest).

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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby north-north-west » Sun 10 Mar, 2019 2:53 pm

I think the idea is to start from Thredbo and ride the chairlift up to Eagles Nest.
From there, the first day takes you to Charlottes via Carruthers etc. There are accommodation options not far down the road. Then Charlottes to Guthega for day two, then Perisher Valley for day three, then Lake Crackenback. Or you start at Lake Crackenback and go in the opposite direction.

It's aimed primarily at the "walk with tiniest possible packs while using luxury accommodation" crowd, aka dumbing down.
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Re: KNP track comments sought

Postby Nuts » Sun 10 Mar, 2019 3:40 pm

That may be so initially. It's almost a given that there will be pressure to capitalise on the profits exclusivity brings, i'd be surprised if it hasn't already been happening.. this park has been mentioned before (if not this particular track). Sooner or later (asap..) an EOI progression to private, in the words of players like AWC 'exclusive', wilderness accommodation in one form or other.
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