Relying on other Hikers for supplies

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Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Tasgirl » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 2:43 pm

Hi Im new to the forum,

My question flows on from the previous post about being unprepared and I mentioned something in response to another hiker that prompted me to want to ask this question.

On my first hike on the overland Track, I packed what I would consider a moderate IFAK. Hub and I have experienced a number of injuries, one fairly serious. These incidents were complete accident and not unavoidable nor could they be predicted. On the occasion I packed a moderate FAK, I used all my supplies prompting another hiker to offer me some of his. I have huge moral issues with this and therefore declined his generous offer. I dont agree that I had the right to take something someone packed and was properly prepared for given they may need to use it themselves. I believe that my Dh and I must be self sufficient and appropriately prepared for all weather or emergencies. If we dont have it, we go without! We also always pack a PLB. Previously we hired them. With that said, I have no issues with an offer of general help or helping others.. I just dont agree on using other peoples supplies esp because pack weight is a really sensitive issue.. It doesnt apply to just to fAks. On one overland track hike, a couple of fenatical lightweighters preaching to us how to lighten our packs failed to pack sufficient cannisters, food, clothes and bog rolls/clothes. Now I think about it, they didnt even have a tent bc they had to race between huts.. By their fourth day they were going around asking other hikers for anything they could get their hands on to get them through the rest of their hike in the way of cannisters and bog rolls. We gave them a cannister, other hikers gave them dribs and drabs of toilet paper. I dont know what they did with the food issue or clothing issue but im guessing they would have froze a bit in their already wet clothes esp bc it was due to snow the following day.

Ive noticed a big trend with americans and lightweight fenatics of packing merely a few bandaids and molskins as their first aid gear and bare bare basics, minus spare clothing as recommended here in Australia. Im assuming this is where that couple picked up their trend with all the bragging about their 10kg pack weight to anyone that would listen. Im not suggesting all lightweighters/ultralighters are like this but it did leave a really bad impression sorry to say.. ...Most of us tuned out btw with the bragging and a lot of the other hikers who grudgingly gave them stock ups let their unhappiness be felt among the other hikers who also helped them out. Thats one thing about the hiling community though that I love. They WILL help you out, even if your a twat so it seems. But I also think perhaps, going on from what others said, we should have all banded together and told them no. To teach them a lesson. It was just difficult to do that because they were not in a position to necessarily simply turn around. It then became an issue of Duty of Care in effect and a lot of hikers do tend to help each other out and look out for one another generally.

Im curious to know where some hikers sit on this issue? To me its an interesting moral issue and one in which some of you have probably come across personally. I realise that in mine and DHs case, that just because we have moral issues using other peoples supplies that some of you may not.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Lamont » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 2:59 pm

I remember reading about some European kids turning up at Mueller Hut in the afternoon (above Aoraki/Mt Cook) without any supplies and deciding they wanted to stay the night -looked like a good place to chill out-and promptly started asking everyone for everything.
The kiwis staying overnight there sent them back down.
It is about 3 hours pretty hard slog back down to the village.
They wrote the cheque and the kiwis cashed it.
mangia, mangia e mangia di nuovo
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby wildwanderer » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 3:17 pm

EDIT- Realised I went on some weird defence of light weight hiking tangent... which wasnt even the question :lol:

First up I would put myself in the light weight hiking category.

My first aid kit (in a zip loc bag) consists of
20 gram swiss army knife with integrated tweezers, pen, scissors
4-5 assorted size band aids
Blister pack of nurofen
blister pack of cold and flu tablets
blister pack of Imodium anti diarrhea
Big roll of Elastoplast tape for taping hot spots, fixing gear, taping wounds.
snake bite bandage. Also doubles as a wound bandage.
BIC lighter, emergency fire starters. Emergency water purification tabs.
All up about 150 grams for total kit.

I also carry a PLB.

I’ve never needed any more even on multiday trips and that FA kit can solve a multitude of problems to keep me happy and walking.

My gear weight is typically about 10kg for a 3-4 day walk including food and water. (assuming water sources are available along the route) This is carryin a 1p tent, stove, sleeping gear and wet/cold weather gear. All my gear is light weight especially the big stuff like pack/tent/sleeping bag/mat. So, I don’t think light weight hiker = unprepared hiker. Keep in mind this gear list is four season (non thick scrub non alpine).


I fully agree that a person should be self-sufficient (or group sufficient if walking with others). If someone wasn’t prepared with sufficient gear then they would find me very reluctant to share unless it was a life or death situation.
Last edited by wildwanderer on Wed 11 Apr, 2018 4:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby crollsurf » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 3:35 pm

You bump into those people in all walks of life. It's not an UL thing per se. Normally what happens towards the end of a walk (even with ultra-lighters) is people have excess food and are trying to palm it of on each other. "My dehydrated food is so nice (yeah right), leave your food in the pack and I'll cook tonight" :lol:
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Tasgirl » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 4:58 pm

wildwanderer wrote:EDIT- Realised I went on some weird defence of light weight hiking tangent... which wasnt even the question :lol:

First up I would put myself in the light weight hiking category.

My first aid kit (in a zip loc bag) consists of
20 gram swiss army knife with integrated tweezers, pen, scissors
4-5 assorted size band aids
Blister pack of nurofen
blister pack of cold and flu tablets
blister pack of Imodium anti diarrhea
Big roll of Elastoplast tape for taping hot spots, fixing gear, taping wounds.
snake bite bandage. Also doubles as a wound bandage.
BIC lighter, emergency fire starters. Emergency water purification tabs.
All up about 150 grams for total kit.

I also carry a PLB.

I’ve never needed any more even on multiday trips and that FA kit can solve a multitude of problems to keep me happy and walking.

My gear weight is typically about 10kg for a 3-4 day walk including food and water. (assuming water sources are available along the route) This is carryin a 1p tent, stove, sleeping gear and wet/cold weather gear. All my gear is light weight especially the big stuff like pack/tent/sleeping bag/mat. So, I don’t think light weight hiker = unprepared hiker. Keep in mind this gear list is four season (non thick scrub non alpine).


I fully agree that a person should be self-sufficient (or group sufficient if walking with others). If someone wasn’t prepared with sufficient gear then they would find me very reluctant to share unless it was a life or death situation.



No offence taken. Reading back I guess in a way I was bashing lightweighter/ultralighters. But I was referring to the ones who have tagged on to a trend without having direct experience in various hiking conditions and personal limitations. They then set out underprepared and then expect others to bail them out when they get into a bind. I have moral issues with this esp when bragging is taking place. Its those so called ultralighters who give a bad impression. I also have issues accepting help when offered it esp when it comes to me personally being unprepared. It goes both ways for me. I dont believe I have any rights to accept anything. Not food, not first aid, not even a hot cup of tea! But I think I have an even bigger issue with taking first aid supplies because thats a safety issue. The person giving their supplies who are appropriately packed, may need what they gave away themselves down the track. Ive got no issues with experienced ultralighters/lightweighters who have made very calculated decisions and ARE prepared as you appear to be.

For us, it was a little difficult not to help them out bc they were 3 days in and 3 days away from civilisation. The guy was a little unfit and in no way would have been able to walk 30 odd km out in a day. I think thats why a lot of us felt obligated to bail him out, even if begrudgenly. I guess, could you call that a Life or Death? Would you still choose not to help? And, if you were in my situation, as someone who hikes light, would you have said anything to them esp because they were preaching about how lightweight they were to other hikers who were prepared. In a way, some of us felt like it was intentional. As in, they banked on others helping them out. They get to go light, others pull the weight for them. Almost like a profession. They were travelling Tasmania and seeking out free accommodation a few days prior sussing people out.
Last edited by Tasgirl on Wed 11 Apr, 2018 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Tasgirl » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 5:01 pm

crollsurf wrote:You bump into those people in all walks of life. It's not an UL thing per se. Normally what happens towards the end of a walk (even with ultra-lighters) is people have excess food and are trying to palm it of on each other. "My dehydrated food is so nice (yeah right), leave your food in the pack and I'll cook tonight" :lol:



The oldest trick in the book :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Lindsay » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 5:13 pm

Hi Tasgirl, welcome to the forum. It is up to each individual to be properly prepared and equipped for anything they might reasonably encounter in the bush. Very bad form to be dependent on others for basic stuff you should have yourself. Of course there are always unforseen circumstances and a time when any of us may need help, but one should try to be as self sufficient as possible.

I understand you are not having a go at the lightweight walkers, and all would agree with you about these clowns. Among the UL community there is an unofficial category known as 'stupid light' which describes your friends on the OLT very well. I consider myself a lightweight walker rather than ultra light, but still have all the gear I need. As far a first aid equipment goes, I can fix a great number of things with a small but comprehensive kit. If I an unable to manage a problem with what I have then it is time for an evacuation.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby wildwanderer » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 5:36 pm

Tasgirl wrote:For us, it was a little difficult not to help them out bc they were 3 days in and 3 days away from civilisation. The guy was a little unfit and in no way would have been able to walk 30 odd km out in a day. I think thats why a lot of us felt obligated to bail him out, even if begrudgenly. I guess, could you call that a Life or Death? Would you still choose not to help? And, if you were in my situation, as someone who hikes light, would you have said anything to them esp because they were preaching about how lightweight they were to other hikers who were prepared. In a way, some of us felt like it was intentional. As in, they banked on others helping them out. They get to go light, others pull the weight for them. Almost like a profession. They were travelling Tasmania and seeking out free accommodation a few days prior sussing people out.


It sounds like their entire MO was to rely on the goodwill of others and avoid expense/weight themselves.. which is really not on.

Would I have helped them out? Probably not.

I doubt I would have shared my gas with them, Im sure they can survive without cooking for 3 days and live off dry food. Toilet paper... haha were there any leaves around :mrgreen: On the other hand if they were at risk of hyperthermia/had an injury or had absolutely no food or water I would stop to help/share etc.

but it really depends on the type of people. If come across someone who has genuinely forgotten something.. then Im willing to share.. but not for people like who you described.

Would I say something? not voluntarily but if I they were asking me for my supplies then I'd likely say I have nothing to spare and mention I spent a fair bit of time before the trip working out what I would need for the trip and I don’t have surplus. (actually, I always carry some emergency food but its for emergency’s not for lazy/dependent people.)
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby slparker » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 5:56 pm

I am happy to share food or first aid supplies to an ultralighter who has neglected to pack the necessities but bushwalking hath no greater lesson than a toilet roll deficit.

let them use cutting grass, I say.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Warin » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 6:20 pm

Tasgirl wrote: I dont believe I have any rights to accept anything.


Humm ... I think you mean no rights to expect something. :?:

There is a certain grace in accepting courtesy, when it is freely offered.
Being open to assistance is a good thing, as most are willing to offer assistance so most should be willing to accept it.

Negotiating the assistance should be done, with care and thought for both sides.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Tasgirl » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 6:37 pm

Lindsay wrote:Hi Tasgirl, welcome to the forum. Thankyou. ☺

I understand you are not having a go at the lightweight walkers, and all would agree with you about these clowns. Among the UL community there is an unofficial category known as 'stupid light' which describes your friends on the OLT very well. I consider myself a lightweight walker rather than ultra light, but still have all the gear I need. As far a first aid equipment goes, I can fix a great number of things with a small but comprehensive kit. If I an unable to manage a problem with what I have then it is time for an evacuation.


Yeah definately not. Because Im relatievely new to the hiking world, Im still at the learner/beginner stage even though ive done a number of multiday walks. Ive spoken to experienced hikers with 10+ years experience, filled with valuable knowledge and Im not arrogant or stupid enough to say Im experienced yet. My heavy pack weight reflects the same. Some of my equipment works, some doesnt. Im always working to improve my equipment, adjust, replace and remove what I dont need or didnt use. Its a process to me. Bagging others for their personal philosophy isnt my bag either. I would then be doing what that couple were doing to us and other people who just packed what they packed. I dont know what we are called. "Heavy weighters" perhaps. ☺ At some point I may need to post my gear list for advice. Im just terrified of judgement. Esp the Ultralight/lightweight community. Ive seen on American YTers get unwarrented backlash from lightweight/ultralight communities.. It borderlines on fenatical. But judging from you and wildwanderer, that may not be applicable to Australian groups. You both seem like open minded, helpful and easy going people. With that said, lightweight would be my goal. One day perhaps.

'Stupid light' is halarious. I think thats what this couple were. 'Stupid light'. All talk and very little gear/knowldge to get them by...... Im glad that you, as a self confessed lightweighter shared my concern with with this couples approach. They were my first introduction to lightweight/ultralight community and you can imagine it didnt leave the best impression. I was genuinely curious if others are like that.

It sounds like their entire MO was to rely on the goodwill of others and avoid expense/weight themselves.. which is really not on.

Would I have helped them out? Probably not.

I doubt I would have shared my gas with them, Im sure they can survive without cooking for 3 days and live off dry food. Toilet paper... haha were there any leaves around :mrgreen: On the other hand if they were at risk of hyperthermia/had an injury or had absolutely no food or water I would stop to help/share etc.

Yes. I would too. DH and I recently got into a knarly medical emergency and we were helped by a number of other hikers.. Its only natural to want to return the favour or help people out. ....even if those individuals were inadequately prepared. It's the hikers way isnt it?

but it really depends on the type of people. If come across someone who has genuinely forgotten something.. then Im willing to share.. but not for people like who you described.

Again, agreed ☺

Would I say something? not voluntarily but if I they were asking me for my supplies then I'd likely say I have nothing to spare and mention I spent a fair bit of time before the trip working out what I would need for the trip and I don’t have surplus. (actually, I always carry some emergency food but its for emergency’s not for lazy/dependent people.)[/quote]

Thats what was so interesting about this couple. He was saying how maticulas he was, weighing and sifting through things he didnt need, yet, not so maticulas when it came to packing what he actually needed. Ie. Spare clothes for camp if he gets walking clothes wet and weather goes cold, Tent for if weather turned nasty, checking cannister. Its one thing to weigh it, its another to check it! Bog rolls. Bogrolls are like gold in the hiking world. 10 sheets per day kinda thing!. Half a role between two people for 10 days spells disaster. They should have packed maybe a role each at minimum. Food. I guess as crollsurf said. People generally pack way too much, usually unintentionally and at some point we either try and eat it or offer it to others.. I suppoes that could be forgiven but at the same time - c'mon! You shouldnt rely on others for that, as you say.

I think from what you and others have said, perhaps my husband and I were a little too generous. I think if I came across a similar scenario, I may say no. I believe its just a one off. But who knows. You meet all types!
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby RonK » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 6:41 pm

In those circumstances I would have given them nothing unless I thought their health/lives were at significant risk.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Tasgirl » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 7:24 pm

slparker wrote:I am happy to share food or first aid supplies to an ultralighter who has neglected to pack the necessities but bushwalking hath no greater lesson than a toilet roll deficit.

let them use cutting grass, I say.


I guess thats what we did, helped them out with supplies. But in future, Im not so sure I'll be so open to it esp. If it was intentional. With that said, when your actually in the situation, its different. People generally want to help others out and not have any harm come to them. Even if you want to choke them at the same time :lol: :lol: :lol:

As for toilet roll deficet, thats like trading gold for pennies.
Warin wrote:
Tasgirl wrote: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I dont believe I have any rights to accept anything.


Humm ... I think you mean no rights to expect something. :?:

Yes, I think you are right. I dont believe I have the right to expect others to help me if I am not sufficiently prepared. Intentionally or unintentionally.

There is a certain grace in accepting courtesy, when it is freely offered.
Being open to assistance is a good thing, as most are willing to offer assistance so most should be willing to accept it.

Negotiating the assistance should be done, with care and thought for both sides.


This is an interesting take and one I appreciate. I felt uncomfortable accepting the offer of assistance bc it was my view, first aid is something you should not skimp on. Its not that I skimpt on my kit per se. I just used most of what I packed. I looked at wildwanders FAk. Mine was substantially more comprehensive (even more so now ) but bc I injured myself a fair bit i used it all. This lovely man saw me and made the offer formhis supplies...Im a royal clutz :lol: :lol: :lol: the following year, my DH used different supplies I happened to pack and forgot about but later remeberd.

My decline was more due to the fact that the guy who offered assistance, also may need what he was giving away to me. My husband and I have been in some serious injuries. Im very sensitive to it tbh. I have an overstocked first aid kit now that a paramedic would be proud of. Im not silly enough to believe westpac rescue helicopter service are just waiting around playing a game of solitaire just waiting for my PLB to go off. Sometimes they can be caught up. 2 heliocopters to cover all of Tassie. Hobart is 2 hours from Cradle by Helicopter. 4 hours return. Longer if both choppers are out or weather is bad. They can also usually only take out one casuality one at a time.. I dont have bare essentials now. I have a myriad of things to cover a multitude of potential scenarios bc you cant predict what the OT will throw at you. I think thats where I come from. I think I also have issues with individuals who in turn pack a bandaid or two, no pressure bandages etc. Again. Thats about my sensitivity I would say. Does that mean I wont help if required. Probably not. Theres a good chance if someone was in a medical emergency, we would definately help and use our supplies.

I dont know if I would accept another offer of first aid supplies in future. Its hard to say. But perhaps I should gracefully accept. I know if tables were turned, and someone was in my situation, I would have made the same offer.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby wildwanderer » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 7:55 pm

Tasgirl wrote: I have an overstocked first aid kit now that a paramedic would be proud of. Im not silly enough to believe westpac rescue helicopter service are just waiting around playing a game of solitaire just waiting for my PLB to go off. Sometimes they can be caught up. 2 heliocopters to cover all of Tassie. Hobart is 2 hours from Cradle by Helicopter. 4 hours return. Longer if both choppers are out or weather is bad. They can also usually only take out one casuality one at a time.. I dont have bare essentials now. I have a myriad of things to cover a multitude of potential scenarios bc you cant predict what the OT will throw at you. I think thats where I come from. .


A bit off topic but I think it’s an interesting discussion. Can a first aid kit really substitute for a situation that requires helicopter evacuation?

My philosophy has always been carry a first aid kit that will
a) remove pain/discomfort of minor injuries/illness and allow me to continue the walk.
b) have equipment that will delay death/further serious injury until help arrives (and assist in summoning help). eg snake bite bandage, PLB etc. Or assist in self-evacuating eg carrying Elastoplast tape to tape/support a sprained ankle etc

You mentioned you used up most of your substantial first aid kit on the OT. Im curious (only if you don’t mind revealing) what the supplies you were using up were? I may need to revaluate what I carry...
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Chunder fuzz » Wed 11 Apr, 2018 8:12 pm

wildwanderer wrote:
A bit off topic but I think it’s an interesting discussion. Can a first aid kit really substitute for a situation that requires helicopter evacuation?

My philosophy has always been carry a first aid kit that will
a) remove pain/discomfort of minor injuries/illness and allow me to continue the walk.
b) have equipment that will delay death/further serious injury until help arrives (and assist in summoning help). eg snake bite bandage, PLB etc. Or assist in self-evacuating eg carrying Elastoplast tape to tape/support a sprained ankle etc

You mentioned you used up most of your substantial first aid kit on the OT. Im curious (only if you don’t mind revealing) what the supplies you were using up were? I may need to revaluate what I carry...


IMO it depends on where you're going, what you'll be doing and how much discomfort you're willing to put up with should something go wrong. That said, I always have a snake bandage for aus walks, bonus is it doubles as a bandage for other things too.

I think there are a few threads on here about first aid kits and how extensive they may or may not be.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby ChrisJHC » Thu 12 Apr, 2018 8:51 am

Re giving food to people who clearly haven’t prepared properly:
Perhaps an option is to ask what they intend to do with it.
If the response is to head back to their car and go home and rethink their circumstances then I’d be inclined to help out.
If the response is to keep going and hope that they’ll be able to get food from other suckers then I probably wouldn’t help out.

Of course, it’s easy to say that I wouldn’t help while I’m at home and it’s all theoretical. It would probably change if I was face to face with them in the bush!


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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Mark F » Thu 12 Apr, 2018 9:55 am

My general approach is that those that come without can go without. I am willing to donate to other walkers if they are in circumstances that are beyond normal conditions. This would normally be first aid or repair items as I only carry enough for me (and my partner) so there is no spare food or gas canisters.

If I am running short of food then I ration it and it is possible to survive without food for a day or so.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Moondog55 » Thu 12 Apr, 2018 12:40 pm

I must admit to being more on the generous side and have helped out/ helped rescue a few people in my time in the hills but I am reminded of the feller that joined us at Pretty Valley a few seasons ago, a very UL hiker all the way down to mesh gym shoes. He was almost in the "Stupid Light" category because he had not planned for non-walking time activity and he had very cold feet. Luckily I had spare warm footwear and I was prepared to let him borrow a pair, but if I was touring he would have had to do the UL "thing " and retire to his pit.
Circumstances will dictate my own response but it would be foolhardy to jeopardise my own safety to help somebody unprepared. As Mark says accident & emergency is a totally different thing
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby rcaffin » Thu 12 Apr, 2018 9:51 pm

The thing which many novice 'UL' walkers don't have is EXPERIENCE. And lacking that can be ... problematic. The gear is of little use if you don't know how to use it.

Would I offer gear to such a one? No, because I/we need every single item we are carrying. Quite literally, we have no spare gear. It's Darwin time.

As for FAK - we carry a good number of band-aids, a full roll of 20 mm micro-pore tape, a few Panadol, a smidgeon of burn cream and BFI. That's about it. In an emergency there are handkerchiefs, sheets of TP, torn-off bits of clothing ... and a mobile phone. One thing we do NOT try to do is substitute for a paramedic in a chopper.

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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby north-north-west » Fri 13 Apr, 2018 8:12 am

One more reason to avoid the huts and crowded tracks.

If someone is in genuine need because something unforeseen has happened, then OK, one helps, whether it's supplies or other practical assistance. But this has to be balanced with one's own requirements - first rule of rescue is to make sure you don't endanger yourself.
If they've just been lazy and are trying to bludge off those of us who have done it right, sod 'em.

As for accepting assistance . . . again, a tricky balancing act. I hate doing it and will almost always try to find my own way out of whatever pickle I've got myself into. Off-track and solo there's usually no-one around who can help anyway.
But you have to be realistic about possibilities and probabilities and conditions. It's sometimes better to bail out early rather than waiting until the *&%$#! has been flung hither thither and yon by the fan.
Last edited by north-north-west on Fri 13 Apr, 2018 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens."
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Lamont » Fri 13 Apr, 2018 9:00 am

Off and /On topic I suppose
"social Darwinism
noun
the theory that individuals, groups, and peoples are subject to the same Darwinian laws of natural selection as plants and animals. Now largely discredited, social Darwinism was advocated by Herbert Spencer and others in the late 19th and early 20th centuries and was used to justify political conservatism, imperialism, and racism and to discourage intervention and reform."
Just the Google definition.-but concise and captures the essence.
This idea provided much of the basis for the exclusionary policies in the recent founding of this country of ours. Best to stay right away from it in my mind.

Most respectfully I am NOT suggesting he has been invoked for these reasons only that he is often mis-quoted and has been a couple of times in recent days.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby rcaffin » Fri 13 Apr, 2018 7:18 pm

No, not 'social Darwinism'. Instead a reference to the well-known Darwin Awards.

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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby north-north-west » Sat 14 Apr, 2018 1:06 pm

Lamont wrote:Off and /On topic I suppose
"social Darwinism
noun
the theory that individuals, groups, and peoples are subject to the same Darwinian laws of natural selection as plants and animals. Now largely discredited, social Darwinism was advocated by Herbert Spencer and others in the late 19th and early 20th centuries and was used to justify political conservatism, imperialism, and racism and to discourage intervention and reform."
Just the Google definition.-but concise and captures the essence.
This idea provided much of the basis for the exclusionary policies in the recent founding of this country of ours. Best to stay right away from it in my mind.


To continue off-topic briefly to get something off my chest: 'Social Darwinism' is just a fancy pseudo-scientific way of say 'Might equals right'.
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby Huntsman247 » Sat 14 Apr, 2018 7:57 pm

crollsurf wrote:You bump into those people in all walks of life. It's not an UL thing per se. Normally what happens towards the end of a walk (even with ultra-lighters) is people have excess food and are trying to palm it of on each other. "My dehydrated food is so nice (yeah right), leave your food in the pack and I'll cook tonight" :lol:


And if your not ultralight then it's the other way around. You say at the start of the walk, "You've got to try this food I've got its awesome! Have some of mine and we'll have yours later." :lol:
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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby weeds » Mon 16 Apr, 2018 10:31 pm

During our OT walk We notice a group of three 2M 1F, where couldn’t work out if the knew each other prior to starting the walk. the female rushed to the next hut each day to secure a bed......she had a very small pack. The guys appeared to be carrying some of her stuff ‘food st least’ and I doubted she had a tent given the urgency to get to the next hut.

I think she had the two guys bluffed.....


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Re: Relying on other Hikers for supplies

Postby wayno » Tue 17 Apr, 2018 5:59 am

some people are ultralight for the wrong reasons.
superiority complex, the novelty, not understanding what they are really getting into, wanting to be different, wanting a change and sometimes evangalising over it
the reality is the more people you run across the more people you are going to find who are ill equiped.... if its a survival issue, some people will feel morally obliged to help... in fact most bushwalkers i know would, you dont have to like it, most don't most experienced bushwalkers pride themselves on being responsible and not being aburdon to others and carrying their full share of gear, i dont think it hurts to read the shirkers the riot act and make it known they arent welcome by the wider hiking community
problem is the parks are accessible to all, and not everyone is going to be prepared... some people dont have the money, they spend all their money travelling around the world then wing it when they get to the bush because they want to spend their cash flying or doing adrenaline sports then see bushwalking as something to do when they run out of spare cash or eek out the dollars... and they go in being a liability to others... theres a massive sign on the tongariro crossing six feet high in massive font telling people to take enough gear for alpine conditions and most don't... and often others have to bale them out giving them gear just to stay alive
from the land of the long white clouds...

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