How young for overnighter?

[Jayps68]

Hi,
My lad is 18 months old, and I am desprately trying to convince his mum that a night in the not too remote bush will not be a problem. We wont be going too far, (as i have to carry everything, including him) but Im just trying to get an idea of a what other people have done with their youngsters; ie, how early did you take them out? Also, suggetsions for possible locations around SEQ for same.

[perfectlydark]

Id personally wait until at least you dont need to carry him and the walk is doable by him (just a short one easy to bug out if needed)

[Son of a Beach]

This is a really tricky one, and last time the question was asked, there was a wide range of opinions.

My kids came on overnight walks with us from the age of a few months, but the first few of these were VERY short walks, and sleeping at a well-equipped hut, which dramatically limited what we had to carry. However, it still meant that we each had to carry either two full packs, or two kids, or one full pack and one kid. The walk in was 45 min and usually easy, however, with the two kids needing to be carried (and all the kid-gear) it was exceedingly difficult (in bad weather too). To be honest, I wouldn't recommend it highly. Perhaps one kid between two adults would be a bit more achievable, but even then, they key factor is to...

Plan to do only the most easy and short walk you can think of (ie, something that's usually an easy, short day walk) and make an overnighter of it. If you find that works well, then you can think of doing something more adventurous afterwards. You will be amazed at just how much more difficult it is with kids who are not old enough to walk themselves. Several people told me this before I tried it, but I still could not appreciate it until it was my turn to give it a shot.

We did the same walk again two years later, and one of the kids walked the whole way. Even still, I chose to walk back to the car and get a second full pack of stuff rather than try to carry it all at once. It was so much better that way (I had to do the walk four times to get everything in and then back out again).

Another point to ponder is: Why are you wanting to take the kids bushwalking at that age? The chances are they are probably not old enough to appreciate it, so it may be worth leaving them with a grandparent for a night or two.

With each of the kids, we did a variety of small walks, including tent-camping near the car, and hut walks.

Soon after they turned 4, they went on their first 'real' overnight-camping-in-a-tent-away-from-the-car-walking-all-the-way bushwalk (to Lees Paddocks in both cases). Just one-on-one, one kid with me (Dad), each in their turn when they turned 4. It depends very much on the child, but one of my kids was MUCH easier than the other one to walk with, but with both of them, I worked out how they work and what makes them tick, and how to make the walking work for/with them.

Critical point: If you kids are walking, feed them frequently! They will be using lots of energy, and if kids get low on energy, they start to get grumpy and difficult and it can be very hard to get them motivated or even moving again. So have plenty of small snacks handy so that you can often give them something nice to eat. They'll love it, and it helps keep the spirits up. If you get any hint of grumpiness, hit the food fast! (I'd personally recommend avoiding lollies, if possible, but if you really do need an fast hit, urgently, then they can help).

Since these 4-yo 'initiation' walks, we've done a few overnighters with the entire family. They mostly love it, but occasionally they do get a bit down and tired (one moreso than the other) and that can make the whole thing a bit tiresome for all of us.

Note that kids are born gear freaks. I think the bit they liked most about their first big walk with Dad, was that they got their own head torch - to keep! And a whistle!

Once your kids are old enough to walk, make sure they carry their own back pack. Even if there's not much in it, they need to get used to the idea, from the very start, that they need to be responsible for carrying their own pack when bushwalking. Getting tiny packs for tiny people is difficult. DO NOT LOAD THEIR PACKS FULL! Tightly packed packs are unconfortable, (as well as heavy). As they get bigger and stronger, they can carry bigger packs with more stuff in them. To start with, the packs are just for psychological training, to make them feel like they're carrying something.

My kids are now 7 and 8 years old, and have done a few overnight walks. These days they carry all their own stuff apart from their sleeping bags and food, and they're on their third back pack each (they just keep growing!). Last year, they walked for 7.5 hours on the first day of a 3 day walk, and a similar time on the 3rd day, carrying their full packs.

Oh, yes, I just remembered... our kids were not fast at learning to use the toilet properly, so I actually had to carry a toilet seat with me on the first few walks, and every time I dug a hole for them, I'd have to place it over the hole in order to make it as easy as possible for them to go (and sometimes they'd have to sit there for a very long time, so it was important for them to be comfortable). That's one of the more interesting bits of gear I've had to carry walking (another was a remote controlled boat, but that's another story for another day).

[Gadgetgeek]

No kids, so I'm most qualified to give advice do overnighters in the yard, if possible, or even the living room. at least so that the tent becomes a familiar and safe place. Other than that, depends on the kid and you, try it out, think about worst case, how far can you carry them and the kid. maybe tracks that are easy enough to carry a gear-cart so that you don't have all the weight. And nothing wrong with starting out at drive up campgrounds with a list of close motels as a bail-out option.

[simonm]

Our kids have been camping since they were only a couple of months old. We also toured around for 5 months living out of a camper trailer starting when my son was 6 months old. Kids adapt well.

[Lizzy]

We liked canoe camping when the kids were little so we could bring heaps of stuff (yes the toilet seat came with us too) & not have to lug it & them. We progressed on to short over nighters with them carrying their own small pack. They enjoy it- but if it is too regular they ask to stay at Nannys

[walkerchris77]

Could always try short walks from car camp spots. My 3 year old girl loves camping and carries her " DINOSAUR PACK PACK" as she calls it. We are off to the grampians tuesday for 3 nights. Great to get them out bush.

[Son of a Beach]

Oh yeah... one more tip... for when your kids are still to young to walk for themselves...

The fancy child carriers are substantially more uncomfortable than a regular bushwalking back pack. Even if the combined weight of child + carrier is the same as your big full back pack, the back pack is way more comfortable. This becomes a significant factor when walking for a long distance/time.

I guess this is due to the nature of the beast... they need some structural rigidity to form a comfortable "chair" for the child, and in doing so, cannot be as comortable for the carrier.

Yes, I've tried several, including Macpac and Kathmandu - some are bettern than others, but all are worse than a normal backpack. I would not want to carry a chile in one of these for more than a couple of hours, personally, although I'm sure there are tougher people than me out there.

[devoswitch]

I love my Osprey Poco and find it really comfortable!

[elray]

For us it was about 6 months. kid sleeps happy in backpack so first overnight was about 12km but nice weather. It is harder to get out hikeing when thare are a bit older 2 to 3 years as thay want to walk. we can only do about 5km now. I love the macpac carrier, carried some big loads and kid and had no problems.

[stry]

Hygiene and toilet training were the limitations for us. No overnight walking until they were at least toddlers. Car based camping - any age.

Babies and toddlers are awfully tenacious of life. A modicum of common sense and using the tips in this thread and you won't break one or freeze one

Children do exhaust easily though, despite their apparently boundless energy, and can hit the wall very quickly. This can lead to a bad experience for the child if you are not alert to the possibility.

[Jayps68]

Thanks for the great advice everyone. Ive no worries about breaking or freezing the boy but thanks for the reminder
I guess the thing im hearing loud and clear, cause i feel that ive got most of the bases covered, is really about weight of gear and kid combined. My solo base wieght is around 12kg, the boy weighs 15... i think it may not be a possibilty... i did carry 26 on the OLT a coule of years ago, but I was a bit stronger and fitter then. not sure i could manage 27 plus food and water...
Car camping may be the go for a while.

[stry]

I have carried something similar to the weight you mention on a SHORT (maybe only a four/five Ks total) overnighter when the toddler ran out of toddle. IIRC I had the tent and two sleeping bags in my share of the load, and added the toddler to the top.

You are wise not to plan on doing that, but as a fall back position, it was nice to know that I could (and did)

[north-north-west]

Well, if a seven year old can do the Larapinta . . .

[wayno]

article here about tramping with toddlier,
some people have problems with hte link aparently but works ok for others

http://www.backpacker.com/skills/beginn ... a-toddler/

[aronwidforss]

Oh yeah... one more tip... for when your kids are still to young to walk for themselves...

The fancy child carriers are substantially more uncomfortable than a regular bushwalking back pack. Even if the combined weight of child + carrier is the same as your big full back pack, the back pack is way more comfortable. This becomes a significant factor when walking for a long distance/time.

I guess this is due to the nature of the beast... they need some structural rigidity to form a comfortable "chair" for the child, and in doing so, cannot be as comortable for the carrier.

Yes, I've tried several, including Macpac and Kathmandu - some are bettern than others, but all are worse than a normal backpack. I would not want to carry a chile in one of these for more than a couple of hours, personally, although I'm sure there are tougher people than me out there.

I'll begin with the disclaimer that I have no experience with children. But I have this idea to modify a external frame to act as a child carrier. This Haglöfs Alaska frame is one of the most comfortable backpacks I've used.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1440021022.955388.jpg (194.52 KiB) Viewed 16591 times

[simonm]

One thing we did, and still do is get the kids used to carrying their own backpack from a young age. When we started I don't think it even had anything in them, maybe a soft toy, but then progressed to the kids requesting to carrying their own water bottle, snacks, nappies, etc. Even when we walk around town now they will request to take their backpacks.

Liffey Fall 2015 008_320x480.JPG (82.28 KiB) Viewed 16585 times

Lobster Falls 001_640x480.JPG (128.4 KiB) Viewed 16585 times

[flyfisher]

Great photo, so cute.

ff

[perfectlydark]

I recognise that photo from a certain DIY gear website

[Son of a Beach]

Great photos Simon. Great moments.

Totally agree about getting them used to the idea of carrying their own packs. I reckon that if they're old enough to walk, they're old enough to carry a pack. I also agree that it's important not to overload their packs. Not only is an overloaded pack uncomfortable for anyone (and tiny packs are very easy to overload), but you want to make it easy for the little ones to make sure that you don't put them off bushalking by a bad experience with a heavy or uncomfortable pack. Just want to get them used to the idea that bushwalking involves carrying a pack with (at least some of) your own stuff in it.

[Son of a Beach]

article here about tramping with toddlier,
some people have problems with hte link aparently but works ok for others

http://www.backpacker.com/skills/beginn ... a-toddler/

Turns out there's a fascinating article on bushwalking with kids in this months BWA magazine also. Looks like there will be a sequel in the next edition too, so be sure not to miss that.

[newhue]

Hi,
My lad is 18 months old, and I am desprately trying to convince his mum that a night in the not too remote bush will not be a problem. We wont be going too far, (as i have to carry everything, including him) but Im just trying to get an idea of a what other people have done with their youngsters; ie, how early did you take them out? Also, suggetsions for possible locations around SEQ for same.

I reckon it depends on how much of a glutton you are for punishment. We did the Hinchinbrook Island with our 6 month old, not quite the same as on your own but it worked. I just carried her in one of those sling things on the front and my pack on the back. The nappies are the killer. Dam things are as bulky as they are heavy. We tried those liner things hoping we could burry them. All a failure, just suck it up and carry them. We also used a slipper type bed, sorry I can't recall the name, but it was like soft squishy lined rectangular bed with a zip over cover. Bit like a zip on doonah that let their little heads pop out the top. We were also not psychotic about little bites, scratches, or eating dirt. But do have a tube of sting goes handy. I think one's littlin walking success is how open minded you are. My wife is pretty casual, the kids are still alive and thriving, Hinchinbrookk was 8 years ago now.
Girraween is a good spot for overnighters. Lower Portals Mt Barney is also good. Nothing like a little bivy on Mt Maroon as well. I recall Forrest Tops Border Rangers was our first camp, that would have been 6 months I guess. Start out using your walking gear but close to the car if it all goes pear shaped. But for your sake you need a remote feel and somewhere you can do a K or two. You also need to step it up for the wife. It's hard and a little stressful for them. So you need to become a bit better.

Good luck. Don't be surprised if you move into car camping. Maintaining overnight walks with little kids just becomes to heavy, even for the dumbest of us like myself.

[Happy Pirate]

We took our bub on his first (car) camping trip at 4 months. A friend backpacked around S America on a climbing trip with a 6 month old. Little bubs are great - they don't run away so you don't have to be constantly hovering, they sleep a lot and it's a great excuse for some really easy walks.
As long as you're prepared and are able to carry them and all they need, almost no age is too young.
Was camping at Mountain Creek with a friend's 2 year old last weekend and it was fantastic watching him explore.

Go for it. Wilderness experience is a lovely gift to give..
Steve