At what point do you "say something" ?

[warnabrother]

In an effort to hide this persons identity (not sure if they are on this forum or not) I've left out location details !

This past weekend, my wife and I headed out for a quick overnighter to an area that is quiet popular with newer, less experienced walkers..

When we left the start point, about 1km in we passed a young guy carrying an obviously VERY heavy pack. Huge pack, probably around 80L, fully loaded and stuff hanging off the outside.

We didn't see him again all day until he arrived at camp approximately 3-4 hours after us and was completely and utterly stuffed. He rested for about 15 mins before proceeding to start pitching his tent.
It was a HUGE car camping style tent and he had a HUGE hammer packed in the pack to knock the pegs in the ground. Then out came the huge cooker with skillet etc. etc. - you get the picture..

My question being - at what point do you say something and how do you start the conversation about him carrying way to much gear and not only that - the wrong gear for bushwalking (in my opinion and most on here I assume)..

I really felt sorry for the guy.. it was a relatively easy 18km or so walk into to camp and he looked like he had climbed Everest !

[Zapruda]

I am an ultralight tragic but I when people tell me how dangerous it is going as light as I do I get annoyed. I imagine it would be the same the other way. I wouldn’t say anything at all.

People need to work things out for themselves. Maybe he couldn’t afford anything else and just took what he had. Maybe this was in his comfort zone. Maybe this is a one time thing for a car camper.

It took me years and too much cash to dial my gear down in both snow and summer. I have spent nearly every weekend out bushwalking or skiing/snowshoeing for years and I am constantly reevaluating my kit on near obsessive levels. For most people this would be ridiculous and unnecessary. They are just happy to be out in the bush.

While I think it is dangerous taking too much heavy gear into the bush I would never assume that my way is right for someone else.

When people do ask me about my gear I am more than happy to explain to them in excruciating detail about all my choices and the logic behind them. They don’t ask again...

Cheers.

[Strider]

By all means I would kick off a conversation about gear, but I wouldn't be critical. I also started with gear much much heavier than I use now, and only improved by seeing both what others were using as well as their techniques (e.g. using a rock found on site, instead of bringing a hammer!).

[crollsurf]

I agree with Strider. Say g'day, if they want a chat, you can always turn the convo to gear but I wouldn't be critical, maybe just show off some of your own gear. They'll get the idea.

[peregrinator]

I agree with Strider. Say g'day, if they want a chat, you can always turn the convo to gear but I wouldn't be critical, maybe just show off some of your own gear. They'll get the idea.

And I agree with you, crollsurf. That's exactly what I would've suggested.

[davidm]

I've been that guy before! You don't need to say anything. He knows.

[wildwanderer]

There is a trend on youtube and Instagram towards traditional gear. They are calling it bushcraft.

https://youtu.be/ByclHHYED_w?t=27m39s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuyGPSRhWkU

Its apparently quite the thing to bring along an axe, hunting knife, wood saw.. grill set.. even a metal lantern. All carried in a canvas traditional style pack with bits hanging off the side. Makes for great photos. Bushcrafters are also into making tent pegs, pot hangers, even shelters etc out of natural materials

Perhaps that’s what this guy gear choices were inspired by. Nothing wrong with it.. its just dam heavy..

[Lamont]

As long as he doesn't look like he'll turn up his heels I reckon he'll be fine. Of course if he asks he'll then either be- full of envy/bored sh_tless or really interested- that's two reasons to one against starting a conversation. No I reckon leave him to it. But then again what's the worst that can happen? Did he have an axe strapped to his rucksack?
Funny this should come up because I passed a couple (no location mentioned also) out for a day walk on Sun. -long heavy pants,gaiters, gloves, beanies, heavy "name brand hiking shirts",40-50l rucksacks full as a goog. It was about 9-10 degrees and they were struggling (and looked like they were roasting) up a steep hill, but had the widest smiles and looked they wouldn't be dead for quids when we spoke. I did not have anything like this on. They were walking and maybe that's all that matters. What is it the seppos say? "Hike your own hike" I say we put the Ausie spin on it and say "Walk your own walk" or WYOW

[Zapruda]

Walk your own walk

Agreed! Well said.

[Lophophaps]

Strider and Crollsurf are on the right track. Gently ease into a good gear discussion, probably showing what can be done with your own gear. No criticism of anything, just ask which is better. I picked up a lot of good ideas in several bushwalking clubs that I belonged to. A few years ago I saw people on extended trips in KNP and the Bogong High Plains, quite small packs, really light. Now I've seen simple things like a tent made from contemporary textiles, thin, strong, light and in places mesh. I've seen very light sleeping mats, light stuff sacks. The big things are easy; small things are a bit harder.

At no stage in my bushwalking life have I ever carried anything like that described in the first post. The biggest pack was probably about 35 kilograms, gear for two weeks and rock gear on top of that. Horrible. On one trip there was a dill with a huge pack, must have been 100 litres and 30+ kilograms for a three day trip. He had a spare tent, spare boots, and a spare pack lashed on the outside with his spare leather belt. We asked him how he would manage, suggested leaving some stuff behind, but no, he said he was okay. He lasted about 30 minutes, then went back to the car. I saw a bloke at Federation hut with hammer for his pegs, which were in a stiff plastic box with a hook thingy for extracting pegs. I think it may have been a Carabee tent.

With care, one can go light and survive well. It needs experience and judgement, can be done. Too much weight is a hazard. The question to ask is, "What is the worst that can happen if I do not have this item?" Another question - "Is there a lighter way?"

[Moondog55]

I'm a firm believer in letting people make their own mistakes, although I might make exceptions if I thought the behaviour might be immediately fatal. Besides that feller with the huge load might be me, it certainly was me 40 years ago

[ChrisJHC]

Perhaps a quick “Hi, how ya going” to break the ice. You could quickly determine whether he wanted to chat or was happy doing things his own way. If a conversation starts, it will inevitably turn to gear!


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[Xplora]

If it was in fact a mistake then he will only make it once. The only problem I have encountered when people make such mistakes is some leave everything they can afford to behind. Tins of food, gas bottles, rubber air beds, camp chairs and even tents. Many years ago I worked casually in an outdoor store and offered advice to a group heading off on a walk. One guy told me how heavy his pack was and I suggested he cut back but he had been in the Army so it would not be a problem. We were actually doing the same walk a day after and picked up stuff that had been dropped then we found their camp. There was nobody around and one tent which would have housed the entire group was so poorly erected with poles and pegs in the wrong place it looked as if it had been blown over. I picked who owned this one right off. We looked inside and found a pantry full of tin food which itself would weigh twice as much as my entire pack. We put the 'found gear' in the tent, fixed the tent up and left a note 'care of the company's customer service team', then continued on our way.

[GPSGuided]

Suspect it won't need to be a directed conversation. A quick hi is all that's needed. I'm sure the guy is aware and can see how easy others are doing the walk and handling camp matters. If he wants to seek advice, he will. Otherwise he knows he'll need to invest and buy new gears. He may or may not be able to afford it and others have no right to stir that pot.

[Eremophila]

Acknowledging that I'm at the lesser-experienced end of the scale - no matter how happy I am with my gear/setup, I'm always keen to observe what others are using and doing. You always come away with ideas. I suspect others, especially newbies, would do the same, albeit discreetly.

[RonK]

Sounds familiar. We were at Waterfall Valley Hut ... a guy arrived late in the afternoon carrying an obviously VERY heavy pack. Huge pack, probably around 90L, a Macpac Cascade I think, the pale blue one. He was completely and utterly stuffed. Dropped his pack to the floor with a crash then collapsed after it.

After 20 minutes or so he revived enough to talk. We didn't hold back - are you crazy? WT *$&# have you got in that pack. He explained that he was touring around on a bicycle and just put all the gear he normally carried on his bike in the pack.

Eventually he revived enough to start preparing a meal. He pulled out an old LP gas stove - the kind with a heavy steel cylinder, a six-pack of beer and bottle of port, and a huge tucker bag. You can't walk the track with all that we told him - you are mad. Go back, we said. So we proceeded to help him lighten his load by drinking the beer and the port. He heated and ate his meal and a few minutes later was out like a light.

Next morning when we left for Windemere he was up having breakfast. He never arrived at Windemere and we never saw him again so we assume he took our advice and went back.

[Xplora]

Sounds familiar. We were at Waterfall Valley Hut ... a guy arrived late in the afternoon carrying an obviously VERY heavy pack. Huge pack, probably around 90L, a Macpac Cascade I think, the pale blue one. He was completely and utterly stuffed. Dropped his pack to the floor with a crash then collapsed after it.

After 20 minutes or so he revived enough to talk. We didn't hold back - are you crazy? WT *$&# have you got in that pack. He explained that he was touring around on a bicycle and just put all the gear he normally carried on his bike in the pack.

Eventually he revived enough to start preparing a meal. He pulled out an old LP gas stove - the kind with a heavy steel cylinder, a six-pack of beer and bottle of port, and a huge tucker bag. You can't walk the track with all that we told him - you are mad. Go back, we said. So we proceeded to help him lighten his load by drinking the beer and the port. He heated and ate his meal and a few minutes later was out like a light.

Next morning when we left for Windemere he was up having breakfast. He never arrived at Windemere and we never saw him again so we assume he took our advice and went back.

He also has some things to learn about cycle touring. That would still be insane to carry on a bike.

[madpom]

If a conversation starts, it will inevitably turn to gear!

Thought that was just me!

[GPSGuided]

...He pulled out an old LP gas stove - the kind with a heavy steel cylinder, a six-pack of beer and bottle of port, and a huge tucker bag. You can't walk the track with all that we told him - you are mad. Go back, we said. So we proceeded to help him lighten his load by drinking the beer and the port...

Your and fellow walkers' ulterior motives exposed!

[ricrunner]

I am a cycle tourist whom mostly tours with a dog in a trailer, and with him there is plenty of water and food(kilo's) .My camping gear such as tent 2.7 kgs and sleeping bag 1.7 kgs would be considered heavy as well as self inflating mat , but that is what I could afford. I also carry an 800g foldable poop shovel as I come across very hard ground in my travels and like to dig down to at least 12 inches. I have light weight cooking gear and stove (were a present). A small transistor radio, A solar panel, Tools and tubes and puncture repair, batteries, spare chain links spokes, lubricants and cleaners, clothes down jacket if cold weather waterproof jacket and pants, there is a bit more plus my food and extra water, the bike weight racks and panniers and also my own weight adds up to 140 kgs average, And I do consider that is a bit heavy especially on hills 10% and above, but there is not too many areas where I can lower that weight without sacrificing items needed. But if you go to bikepacking forums these guys and gals are doing with no more then their bike weight themselves plus about 7kgs. So I do consider that I am definitely up there for extra weight then is probably really required, but I don't think I'm at the level of what OP was talking about. If I could afford lighter gear I would buy it though.

[ribuck]

...I come across very hard ground in my travels and like to dig down to at least 12 inches...

To each his own, but soil is most biologically active around 4 to 6 inches down, and faeces actually takes longer to decay at 12 inches.