Flawed thinking?

[Ent]

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[ILUVSWTAS]

Wheres the thread on the missing hiker??

[Ent]

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[ILUVSWTAS]

I see...
Probably a choice up to the individual at the time. You would think most people would take their own experience and things like the weather into account when making such decisions.

[Maelgwn]

When heading to a hut I notice that a lighter version of the tent is sometimes taken. I.e. fly only. Um? If we do not make it to the hut does this not suggest that one reason was the weather was nasty so maybe we needed the "best" shelter instead? (Stroller's Lake Meston walk comes to mind but all had packed sufficient quantity and quality of tents)

When peak bagging the tendency is to leave the main pack behind and take minimal gear. Um? Is it not likely to be coldest and most exposed on the peak? (Thread on missing hiker in bad weather with pack left at hut)

I think people are more likely to need there shelter when heading to a hut if some one is injured or the hut is full. A is almost as sheltered as a full tent and if some work is done to prevent water entering and what not, then you will be safe and sound enough in there. Many tent features are for convenience and comfort but you dont really need these features, if you ever needed to use it fly only, you could do without them.

When peak bagging, you need to look at the conditions and take what you need.

[flyfisher]

Wheres the thread on the missing hiker??

There is a thread on Clare Hutchison who went missing in dec 2000 from the pine valley hut.

She went on a day walk leaving her main pack at the hut, and was never seen again.

ff

[BarryJ]

It's here:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=610&start=0&hilit=Hutchison

[ILUVSWTAS]

Ok yeh I remember that.
Very sad!

[Nuts]

Brett, seems to me that, in going through a list of all the gear your pack would contain (and as mentioned), very little is actually 'needed' if it comes to a 'survival' situation. This is really the same as the thinking behind the 'ulw concept'... the point on the 'continuum of comfort' that your satisfied with is still (for most) far more than 'needed' when it comes to the crunch. On the meston walk you could have laid down in a bivy bag and 'survived' the night (probably a bit miserable but perhaps in no worse shape )

Although sad, i dont see that Clares situation is really relivant, she went for a 'side-trip' and little is known from there. On such a trip, most people (and her most likely) would have been wise enough to take the essentials to 'survive'.

[Ent]

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[MJD]

What's the problem with dropping your pack and racing up the peak? I do it all the time and have no intention of changing. You travel quicker and arrive in much better condition. Of course if you have an accident then you may wish that you had a bit more gear. Still, look on the bright side - at least you know where all your gear is.

On a more serious note there is a very good book titled "Survive! Remarkable tales from the New Zealand Outdoors" about "who lives, who dies" that also touches on OH&S, hindsight etc.

[Dave Bremers]

On the same note as MJD, I cannot recommend highly enough the book 'Deep Survival' by Laurence Gonzales. Goes into the WHOLE story, right through from brain chemistry outwards to closed systems and chaos theory. Explains why people just disappear, while a four-year-old will survive, why people make 'stupid' decisions in the first place. Whilst it may sound complicated it is explained very well and is easy to understand. Yes that's a bit of a plug but I'm reading it for the third time so I'm being honest about this!

The whole area of personally responsibility comes into this too - if your racing up a peak after dumping your pack (something which I do, and at places like Fedder is the safe thing to do) you have to realise that you not going to have all the equipment you would have otherwise. Duh. And adapt to the situation too - if the weather looks bad you might decide not to go for it afterall. I was taught in DofE to always take a 'survival kit' when doing things like this - you know, matches, candle, survival blanket, fishing line, string etc. - just an emergency backup so you could at least SURVIVE, even if not very comfortably.