Downsizing the Tarptent Scrap 1

[Aushiker]

My Tarptent Scrap 1 is off to a new home so I need to replace it. All my camping is solo, mainly bicycle based (touring and bikepacking) here in Western Australia. My bushwalking and riding season is Autumn, winter and spring. My focus now days is minimal weight and small as possible pack size.

I did like the spaciousness of the Scarp 1 and whilst that is probably overkill for solo use I not that keen on going to the other extreme with a coffin.

My short list is:

ZPack Altaplex - 663g/23.4oz - AU$920
ZPack Duplex - 759g/26.76oz - AU$931
MLD Solomid w/Innernet - 719g/25.36oz - AU$785
MLD Duomid w/Innernet - 875g/30.86oz - AU$846

The weights include stakes and Zpack poles as I don’t use trekking poles on the bike.

I did consider the Cirriform SW 1 person but it appears from the video I saw to have little to no internal space for gear plus at 813g/28.68oz it is at the heavier end.

The Cirriform SW 2 person is simply too heavy at 1020g/35.98oz.

My other thought was a MLD Solomid or Duomid with a Zpacks Splash bivy or MLD Superlight bivy but there is simply not enough weight saving for me to justify the experiment. In fact the Solomid was heavier going this way so the Duomid/SuperLight combo would be the only option at 725g/19.86oz.

I also briefly considered the Nordisk Telemark 2 ULW but it is heavy in comparison at 898grams plus stakes and bags and the cost is around AU$701.

My thinking is toward the Zpack Altaplex or Duplex but then the cost saving favours the MLD options, but at a weight penalty and the hassle of having to source poles elsewhere.

Keith Foskett’s review of the Altaplex suggests that it would have the minimal interior space that I would desire.



Any other suggestions? Thoughts? Is the Duplex the better option? It seems to get a lot of love online.

[Stew63]

Why not just go a ZPack cuben fibre tarp at only ~150gm. Will save you a ton of weight and you won't feel like you're sleeping in a coffin.

[RonK]

From the bikepacking perspective I don't see the point in chasing grams. I think the main constraint to bikepacking is volume, not weight. That said, the one follows the other for the most part.

I've staked my tent requirements accordingly - so weight preferably less than 1 kg and more importantly the tent fabric to fit in an Anything bag. Poles to be readily removable so they can be carried separately.

Hpwever since you are looking at cuben fibre I though these Hyperlight tents I stumbled over recently may be of interest. The gotcha is they are made for use with trekking poles, so may be of more interest to walkers, but it should be easy enough to source some suitable tent poles.

I was impressed by the Echo II Ultralight Shelter System. Check out the video. Their other gear looks very classy also and well worth a look.

[Eljimberino]

It depends on:

1) how much time you plan hanging around camp (comfort)
2) how much fiddle factor you like
3) your budget
4) how soon you need it
5) how modular you want it to be
6) how long you want it to last.

[GPSGuided]

Didn't someone just sold one of these (or something really similar) on this forum recently?

[Mark F]

A couple of comments. I find my Solplex (580g with poles and pegs) has enough room for me and my gear. I much prefer a side opening tent as it allows over half the vestibule to be used for gear storage compared to a front opening tent. With a front opener for one the majority of the vestibule ends up being a squeeze way. In the Solplex I have pretty much all my gear apart from shoes and water bottles. I think for cycle touring my choice would be to use the Solplex and carry a small cf tarp to put the bike under/sit under in rain etc. I will be able to comment further once I start cycling the North Sea Cycle Route next week.

On this trip I actually have a Six Moons Designs cf Haven 2 person tent with net inner (970g with poles and peg) as my partner will be joining me on weekends.

[Aushiker]

Hpwever since you are looking at cuben fibre I though these Hyperlight tents I stumbled over recently may be of interest. The gotcha is they are made for use with trekking poles, so may be of more interest to walkers, but it should be easy enough to source some suitable tent poles.

I did look at these but the prices where just too high; more expensive that Zpack which is really my limit. For example the one you linked to is the outer only at US$700 just for the outer, then you need to add the inner.

[Aushiker]

A couple of comments. I find my Solplex (580g with poles and pegs) has enough room for me and my gear. I much prefer a side opening tent as it allows over half the vestibule to be used for gear storage compared to a front opening tent. With a front opener for one the majority of the vestibule ends up being a squeeze way. In the Solplex I have pretty much all my gear apart from shoes and water bottles.

Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look at it. I agree with you re the side-opening in more "traditional" tent shapes.

[damoprz]

I did look at these but the prices where just too high; more expensive that Zpack which is really my limit. For example the one you linked to is the outer only at US$700 just for the outer, then you need to add the inner.

That is not correct, The HMG Echo II is $700 US for tarp, beak, inner and stuff sack. The tarp by itself is only $320 US. Still more expensive than Zpacks, but the build quality is great (I have one) and cat cut tarps are super easy to pitch.

[Eljimberino]

Here's a Trailstar in bike touring mode (not mine). The MLD pro-silnylon is really nice.

[Aushiker]

I did look at these but the prices where just too high; more expensive that Zpack which is really my limit. For example the one you linked to is the outer only at US$700 just for the outer, then you need to add the inner.

That is not correct, The HMG Echo II is $700 US for tarp, beak, inner and stuff sack. The tarp by itself is only $320 US. Still more expensive than Zpacks, but the build quality is great (I have one) and cat cut tarps are super easy to pitch.

Thanks for the correction. I had looked at the UltraMid 2 and assumed the same applied to the HMG Echo II. From what I can find out the weight is 856 grams plus poles (need to check the requirements there) plus stakes (?). The cost excluding poles and stakes is $931. The Zpacks Duplex weighs in at 759g complete and costs the same base price at $931.

Whilst they seem to have one hell of a reputation, it is probably the second heaviest option and most expensive in my list so far. Zpack also has a good reputation and costs less and weighs less it seems ...

[RonK]

The Zpacks Duplex weighs in at 759g complete and costs the same base price at $931.

The Zpacks Duplex seems impressive - until you see it packed and consider how you would carry it in bikepacking bags.



As per my previous comments - packed size is more important than weight when carrying space is so limited.

[damoprz]

Thanks for the correction. I had looked at the UltraMid 2 and assumed the same applied to the HMG Echo II. From what I can find out the weight is 856 grams plus poles (need to check the requirements there) plus stakes (?). The cost excluding poles and stakes is $931. The Zpacks Duplex weighs in at 759g complete and costs the same base price at $931.

Whilst they seem to have one hell of a reputation, it is probably the second heaviest option and most expensive in my list so far. Zpack also has a good reputation and costs less and weighs less it seems ...

Yeah, the inner they provide is way too heavy. I currently just use a groundsheet, and plan to get a bug bivy for summer. If an inner tent is a must for you, it is probably not the best option.

[Mark F]

I recently made a set of panniers based on the old Karrimor Iberian model (I had a single dead one that I deconstructed for a pattern) which are meant to be 15 litres each so not large in the world of panniers. I can get my Solplex, quilt, mat and cooking gear in one leaving the other for food, clothes etc. At worst the tent gets strapped on top of the rack. It becomes more of a problem if you are bike packing rather using panniers and rack.

Re the Echo II, it certainly is one of the most bombproof Cuben shelter I have seen but I believe the aim is for maximum usage space rather than maximum stormworthiness.

[Stew63]

Can you buy the beak separately? So just a beak and tarp setup.

[damoprz]

Can you buy the beak separately? So just a beak and tarp setup.

I bought it second hand, I believe you used to be able to buy the beak separately, but now they just have tarp only or the full system. It would be worth sending them an email and trying to get just the beak.

[Aushiker]

The Zpacks Duplex weighs in at 759g complete and costs the same base price at $931.

The Zpacks Duplex seems impressive - until you see it packed and consider how you would carry it in bikepacking bags.

The quoted pack size is 13 x 7 compared to your ProTrail at 12 x 4 which is really not that bad when you consider it is a two person tent versus a single person tent; the physical nature of more material means more pack size.

In my case it will be going on the left Salsa Anything Cage HD so whilst pack size is important without a doubt, weight is too.

[Aushiker]

Yeah, the inner they provide is way too heavy. I currently just use a groundsheet, and plan to get a bug bivy for summer. If an inner tent is a must for you, it is probably not the best option.

I looked at this option with an MLD Solomid and a Duomid using either a MLD SuperLight or Zpacks Spash Bivy and there does not appear to be much in it weight wise. In fact the Solmid came up heavier with a bivy where as the Duomid had savings worth considering.

I haven't done the maths with a HMG but.

[damoprz]

I looked at this option with an MLD Solomid and a Duomid using either a MLD SuperLight or Zpacks Spash Bivy and there does not appear to be much in it weight wise. In fact the Solmid came up heavier with a bivy where as the Duomid had savings worth considering.

I haven't done the maths with a HMG but.

I use a ~40 gram polycryo groundsheet, no bivy currently as the Echo II is huge and with the beak on I am not to worried about splash reaching me in the middle. My summer bug bivy is going to be MYOG and very minimal, something like S2S nano mosquito net, which is ~80 grams, so I am thinking 100 grams. This will make my tarp + bugscreen ~550g + pegs. The MLD bug bivy is only ~ 141 grams.

[RonK]

The quoted pack size is 13 x 7 compared to your ProTrail at 12 x 4 which is really not that bad when you consider it is a two person tent versus a single person tent; the physical nature of more material means more pack size.

In my case it will be going on the left Salsa Anything Cage HD so whilst pack size is important without a doubt, weight is too.

Well - seeing is believing - that is why I posted the image.

The Anything Cage was designed to carry the upper object. Will it carry the lower one?



As for the Protrail - it definitely fits inside a BBD Anything Bag, for carriage in an Anything Cage.

[Eljimberino]

I had a hexamid solo plus but I preferred a flat tarp in the end. The altaplex is a bigger hexamid. As Foskett mentions in his review the single guyline on the pole side is a bit wobbly.

I have a zpacks splash bivy if you would like to check it out Andrew.

[Aushiker]

I use a ~40 gram polycryo groundsheet, no bivy currently as the Echo II is huge and with the beak on I am not to worried about splash reaching me in the middle. My summer bug bivy is going to be MYOG and very minimal, something like S2S nano mosquito net, which is ~80 grams, so I am thinking 100 grams. This will make my tarp + bugscreen ~550g + pegs. The MLD bug bivy is only ~ 141 grams.

Sounds like a nice setup .. MYOG is however not in my lexicon

[Aushiker]

I have a zpacks splash bivy if you would like to check it out Andrew.

Thanks. I may take you up on that offer.

[Aushiker]

As for the Protrail - it definitely fits inside a BBD Anything Bag, for carriage in an Anything Cage.

Good to know. It has been mentioned over at Backpacking Light that silnylon is more packable than cuben fibre so something else to keep in mind in the decision making process.

[Aushiker]

I can get my Solplex, quilt, mat and cooking gear in one leaving the other for food, clothes etc.

How do you find the interior space of the Solplex? Can you get yourself and your gear in the tent comfortably?

Trailspace have this to say on space:

At 5’11’’ this tent has plenty of room for me to lay in without touching the ends. I usually use the extra space to store my pack and other gear. It is just over 7 feet long, 30 inches wide and at its peak is 48 inches tall. Not a lot of room on either side while laying down, and not a lot of headroom while sitting up. If you are the type of person that spends a lot of time in a tent, likes a lot of extra space, or, if you are big and tall, you might want to consider stepping up in tent size.

On the other hand Gnarly River seems to be happy with the space:

[jakeyarwood]

Some excellent info here. Andrew, I'm just curious - what lead you away from the Locus Gear Khufu as spoken of in a previous thread? I'm yet to purchase my new ground system is all and am still undecided.

[Aushiker]

Some excellent info here. Andrew, I'm just curious - what lead you away from the Locus Gear Khufu as spoken of in a previous thread? I'm yet to purchase my new ground system is all and am still undecided.

Memory ... whoops. Thanks for the reminder but. I had forgotten how interesting they look.

I just did some number crunching and going with the Khufu CT3 + full mesh + 16 stakes (max requirement) + Zpacks pole it comes in at 734 grams, but the cost is up there at $1,033 + postage. There are weight saving opportunities by going with less mesh and possibly less stakes. That will also save a few dollars.

I do like the idea of being able to use less mesh to create a vestibule within shelter.

Not sure on pack size but, so need to investigate that further.

[Mark F]

I am much happier with the Solplex compared to my Hexamid plus for room and ease of entry. I attribute the feeling of extra room to the use of two poles rather than one. This causes the slope of the roof to be less over the sleeping area as it is only sloping along the length rather than the width. The entry is taller than the Hexamid, without checking it is the same as the Duplex.

I am also 180cm and have no issues. I tend to put most of my gear up the head end for ease of access. My pack also goes at the head end to lift my pillow a bit although I am still playing around with the best placement of the pillow.

My only negative is a personal one. I prefer an inverted T format or L for the door zips.

[Aushiker]

Not sure on pack size but, so need to investigate that further.

A bit of an idea of the packed size can be seen in this video.

Better still are these photos of the SilNylon from Hiking Finland which I understand packs down better than the Cuben Fibre version.





and one more ...

[Aushiker]

I am much happier with the Solplex compared to my Hexamid plus for room and ease of entry. I attribute the feeling of extra room to the use of two poles rather than one. This causes the slope of the roof to be less over the sleeping area as it is only sloping along the length rather than the width. The entry is taller than the Hexamid, without checking it is the same as the Duplex.

I am also 180cm and have no issues. I tend to put most of my gear up the head end for ease of access. My pack also goes at the head end to lift my pillow a bit although I am still playing around with the best placement of the pillow.

My only negative is a personal one. I prefer an inverted T format or L for the door zips.

Thanks Mark. Most helpful.