Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

A place to chat about gear and the philosphy of ultralight. Ultralight bushwalking or backpacking focuses on carrying the lightest and simplest kit. There is still a good focus on safety and skill.
Forum rules
Ultralight Bushwalking/backpacking is about more than just gear lists. Ultralight walkers carefully consider gear based on the environment they are entering, the weather forecast, their own skill, other people in the group. Gear and systems are tested and tweaked.
If you are new to this area then welcome - Please remember that although the same ultralight philosophy can be used in all environments that the specific gear and skill required will vary greatly. It is very dangerous to assume that you can just copy someone else's gear list, but you are encouraged to ask questions, learn and start reducing the pack weight and enjoying the freedom that comes.

Common words
Base pack backpacking the mass of the backpack and the gear inside - not including consumables such as food, water and fuel
light backpacking base weight less than 9.1kg
ultralight backpacking base weight less than 4.5kg
super-ultralight backpacking base weight less than 2.3kg
extreme-ultralight backpacking base weight less than 1.4kg

Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Sun 17 Mar, 2019 7:28 pm

Rainy day here in Sydney so I got out the scales and loaded up excel. Came up with a ultra light overnight gear list based on what I currently own.
Hope to test it within the next 2 weeks.

Any one else want to have a crack? How low can you go :lol:

Summer/Autumn Ultralight Overnight Gear List
Designed for night time temps 10C and above.

Shelter/ Mat
Gatewood cape/tarp (sil nylon)
Polycro Gnd sheet
6 ti pegs
Sea to summit nano suspended bug net
Nemo tensor 20s 3/4 length inflatable mat
= 708 grams

Pack/Pole/Sit mat
Osprey talon 18L Pack
Pack liner (garbage bag)
Komperdell walking/tent pole (single)
Foam sit mat and extra garbage bag to sit on.
= 823 grams

Clothing/Sleep system
Target night temprature +10C
OR Hooded Down Jacket. 195g of down fill.
Beanie
Mountain designs cold weather 160gsm Fleece pants
thick wool blend socks
= 846 grams

Rain gear
Columbia Rain jacket with hood
= 333 grams

Cooking
Ti 500ml pot/mug with lid
Soto Amicus stove
ti long spoon
=227 grams

Water
2 x 1l PET bottles
6 x water purification tabs
= 61 grams

First Aid/Sanitary
First Aid Kit
setopress snake bite bandage x1 and 1/2
toilet paper
mini tube sanitiser
mini tube repellent
mini tub sunscreen
=205 grams

Emegency + Navigation
Garmin inreach mini
Mobile phone with nav app
Black Diamond headtorch
keys/wallet
=450 grams

Base weight
=3.683 kg


Consumables
Food for 1 and 1/2 days = 1kg
Water 1L = 1kg
Gas. 1/3 full 110 canister = 148 grams
= 2.148kg total.

Grand Total
= 5.831 kg


The purpose was to see how light I could go with my existing stuff without reaching stupid light.. (well maybe i did a bit with a 3.6 kg base weight)

Be interesting to see if I made the right choice with leaving the quilt at home and instead bringing extra warm clothing. My reasoning was the location I'l test this doesnt allow fires and so I wanted gear to be warm during the evening at camp. Past experience shows the down jacket and fleece pants combo should keep me warm at about 8-10C and above. And i can always put on the rain jacket and put my legs into my pack if I need a boost.

Idealy Id like a summer/autumn quilt as my winter one is -10C rated and at 780 grams is a bit heavy for this gear list. Hopefully Costco does the BD throw Quilts again soon.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby andrewa » Sun 17 Mar, 2019 8:36 pm

You’d survive, but I’d personally prefer to somehow add a v light quilt, and offload other stuff.

Eg why have an inflatable mat, when you could have 100x40cm of 3mm “portable concrete” ( ie closed cell foam mat); replace suspended but net with a head net (as you now have a quilt), get rid of foam sit mat, as your portable concrete can be folded to sit on, reduce weight of rain jacket (eg frog togs, or Z-packs if $ to spare), minimise first aid kit....all this would allow a quilt.

It really comes down to survive vs comfortable vs fun. I’m aiming for the lighter aspect of the fun end....but I make my own gear to minimise weight, and maximise multipurpose.

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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Sun 17 Mar, 2019 8:50 pm

andrewa wrote:You’d survive, but I’d personally prefer to somehow add a v light quilt, and offload other stuff.

Eg why have an inflatable mat, when you could have 100x40cm of 3mm “portable concrete” ( ie closed cell foam mat); replace suspended but net with a head net (as you now have a quilt), get rid of foam sit mat, as your portable concrete can be folded to sit on, reduce weight of rain jacket (eg frog togs, or Z-packs if $ to spare), minimise first aid kit....all this would allow a quilt.

It really comes down to survive vs comfortable vs fun. I’m aiming for the lighter aspect of the fun end....but I make my own gear to minimise weight, and maximise multipurpose.

A


Thanks for the feedback.

Ideally id prefer the costco BD quilt. At 460 grams it would be perfect. and cause its $30 Id happily ditch most of the warm clothing and use the costco quilt for warmth while sitting up at camp where as my $460 quilt im a bit more careful of. However I think il have to wait until late April before they stock them again in Australia.

I need an inflatable mat to have a good nights sleep. Ive tried and failed to sleep well on close cell foam.

Rain jacket, I could swap to a lighter but I like this rain jacket as it doesnt wet out.

First aid kit is already fairly minimal, what weighs a bit is the compression snake bandages (not leaving them behind) and the sanitiser, sunscreen and repellant. All custom mini tubes/bottles but it does add up

bug net.. I do own a head net as well but I dont find it comfortable to sleep with. Plus Id be paranoid leaches or crawlies would be making their way to me :lol:

I should mention, that the down jacket is a very good insulator (190 grams of 800 loft power fill.) I take it down to 0 and im warm. Thats sitting up at camp and eating (no fire). So im estimating I wont be cold sleeping in the current temps as its still 15C+ at night. I wouldnt be pushing this setup into winter though.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby ChrisJHC » Mon 18 Mar, 2019 7:30 pm

You could replace the tarp/bug net/stakes with a bivvy bag with built in bug net.
Nowhere near as comfortable as a tarp if it’s raining but you’ll survive.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby ribuck » Mon 18 Mar, 2019 8:03 pm

In NSW there are places where we can have a fire and sleep under a rock overhang. So I would ditch the tarp, the bug net, the stove, the gas canister, the purification tablets, and the sitmat.

But I need a full length mat and something over me at night, even if it's just a sheet.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby johnw » Tue 19 Mar, 2019 12:47 pm

wildwanderer wrote:what weighs a bit is the compression snake bandages (not leaving them behind)

Not suggesting to compromise safety but do you need two of them? Would just the wider one do?
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Tue 19 Mar, 2019 2:24 pm

johnw wrote:
wildwanderer wrote:what weighs a bit is the compression snake bandages (not leaving them behind)

Not suggesting to compromise safety but do you need two of them? Would just the wider one do?


Was a bit of discussion a month or so ago on this and based on the advice given Ive added an extra bandage.

Apparently best practice is a small compression bandage around the bite site for venom stasis and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from top to bottom.

So thats why I have a large compression bandage and then I cut up a second one to make the smaller length.

Ref - to discussion: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=28943&start=30#p366725
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby johnw » Tue 19 Mar, 2019 3:03 pm

wildwanderer wrote:Apparently best practice is a small compression bandage around the bite site for venom stasis and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from top to bottom.

So thats why I have a large compression bandage and then I cut up a second one to make the smaller length.

Ref - to discussion: http://www.bushwalk.com/forum/viewtopic ... 30#p366725

Thanks, I must have missed reading that bit :)

Then the only other suggestion is to eat less :wink:
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Moondog55 » Wed 03 Apr, 2019 5:25 pm

I'll have a crack at it.
But for snow when white season hits. I didn't do my usual quick ski over to Hotham from Pretty Valley last ski season given the new hip and everything I was very tentative about pushing myself..
But I need some guidance as to what you consider UL for snow and expected overnite temperatures of -10C
I have some new and untested UL toys to play with and a pack a full kilo lighter than my WE Alpine Expedition
Ve are too soon old und too late schmart
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Gippsmick » Wed 03 Apr, 2019 7:53 pm

Nice wildwanderer. What's your comfort level. Would be fun to see how far you can push this. Number one rule for packing - don't pack your fears.
Ditch the pegs and use sticks. Ditch the foam sit pad and just sit on the garbage bag. Are you expecting rain - if not ditch the jacket and rely on your shelter/tarp if it does rain. Carry 1 PET bottle and a platypus if you need more water capacity. Go stoneless and cold soak. Other than a band aid when was the last time you used anything from your first aid kit? Are you planning to walk at night - if not trade the black diamond head lamp for a petzel elite. Garmin in reach mini - yeah you better take that.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby enlightened0ne » Mon 15 Apr, 2019 11:44 am

Why do you bring a rain jacket as well as a hardwood cape? I thought the point of the cape was to do double duty. You could always bring a windshirt if it’s for wind protection while walking.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Mon 15 Apr, 2019 4:46 pm

enlightened0ne wrote:Why do you bring a rain jacket as well as a hardwood cape? I thought the point of the cape was to do double duty. You could always bring a windshirt if it’s for wind protection while walking.


Mostly because I don't own a wind shirt but also because I've intergrated the Gatewood Cape with a sts 80gram nano bugnet. Not to big a deal but I'd rather not untie/retie the shockcord connecting the net to the Cape potentially in the rain/mud.

Even though I'm attempting to go very light I'm still making compromises for comfort/usability.

Should hopefully be able to test this weekend:D

Will tweak from there.. lots of good suggestions re going even lighter ie replacing the black diamond with a e-lite etc it just comes down to what I currently own.

(I wish Costco would hurryup and stock the diamond throw quilts again)
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Fri 19 Apr, 2019 7:50 pm

Returned from my overnight UL gear experiment trip. It went really well. Total weight including food/water was 5.6kg. Base weight about 3.7kg. Gave a silent chuckle passing a few people huffing and puffing with 15-20kg packs and doing the same distance/walk as me. Only thing different from above list was I took only single 1L water bottle and added a empty 2L bladder for camp water. Also reduced the food down to 700-800 grams. Which proved ample.

The down jacket and fleece pants worked fine, in fact because it was a mild night, I was actually too hot and needed to unzip the jacket. My pack made a decent pillow and I used my shoes/water bottles to stretch out the bug net to create more room inside.

After cooking a nice meal of cous cous, melted cheese, veges and salami I realised i had no washing up liquid or sponge. :oops: However did the old fill up the pot with sand/dirt trick . Was a great cleaner, smell remover. Quick rince with water and good as new. :)

I practised packing/unpacking inside the tarp, as I wanted to see how it would work if I needed to setup in the rain. Should work fine.

The only thing I need to do differently is find a good pole extender for my trekking pole. My pole comes to 100cm, I really need 110-120cm to maximise the interior headroom of the tarp. Currently using a cheap chinese extender and it sucks as doesn’t fit so i needed to velcro it (badly) to the trekking pole.

tarp setup.jpg
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Neo » Sun 15 Sep, 2019 8:15 pm

I'm going to dabble in this. I have most of the bits aready! See if I can do 5kg instead of 10, for one night fitness walks.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Mark F » Sun 15 Sep, 2019 9:46 pm

Getting to 5kg +- 0.5kg is not particularly difficult for above freezing conditions. Getting below 4kg requires a fair bit more effort, so congrats ww.
"Perfection is attained not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing more to remove".
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Moondog55 » Mon 16 Sep, 2019 3:03 pm

I didn't have a great winter but I did try my best. I got it down to 14kilos all up with fuel and food and I was cold at a soggy -5 to -8C I am full of admiration for those hardy folk who can really travel as light as 5 kilos. As I noted in the other thread I also ate 3 days food allowance in only 2 days but I plead ill health there or insufficient clothing.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby ribuck » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 8:26 am

wildwanderer wrote:Apparently best practice is a small compression bandage around the bite site for venom stasis and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from top to bottom.

Just in case anyone memorises that by heart, the best practice is actually a small compression bandage around the bite site and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from bottom to top.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 9:08 am

ribuck wrote:
wildwanderer wrote:Apparently best practice is a small compression bandage around the bite site for venom stasis and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from top to bottom.

Just in case anyone memorises that by heart, the best practice is actually a small compression bandage around the bite site and then a longer one encompassing the entire limb from bottom to top.


Thanks ribuck. I just did a quick review of the literature and your correct. Logically I would have thought going from bottom to top would push the venom up to the heart but as the literature recommends it, that certainly trump's the logic.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby ribuck » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 11:12 am

wildwanderer wrote:Logically I would have thought going from bottom to top would push the venom up to the heart...

I think the problem is that if you bandage from top to bottom the blood and lymphatic fluid will have nowhere to go and it will be difficult to get enough compression. Bandaging from bottom to top lets you apply good compression all the way, and hopefully the venom will not yet have travelled far enough up the limb to be squeezed out the top by the bandaging process.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Ms_Mudd » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 12:05 pm

Awesome, love this!
I can cut and paste some of your stuff as we have the same cooking set up.
Game on !
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 2:02 pm

Looking forward to see what you come up with ms_mudd.

I found it quite enjoyable to see what I could leave out and still have a comfortable and safe trip.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby Ms_Mudd » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 2:31 pm

wildwanderer wrote:Looking forward to see what you come up with ms_mudd.

I found it quite enjoyable to see what I could leave out and still have a comfortable and safe trip.

It will be my mission tomorrow I think to set my pack up for an overnighter and hopefully follow through with it the following week.

I was all about rambling on that I go for comfort, not gram savings in my gear choices blah blah...however over time I have come to realise that less weight on my back makes for more overall comfort and have now nearly hit UL status with my set up without meaning to.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby crollsurf » Tue 09 Mar, 2021 7:29 pm

Been a while since I weighed my gear so had a go using a newish site called packfire.com (buggy so a bit of work for them to get it right ATM)
https://packfire.com/packs/futxgcbqlm
A smig under 3kg base if you count poles as worn weight, happy with that plus I don't always bother with cooking on an overnighter
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby ribuck » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 7:35 am

That is truly impressive! You could save a bit more weight by swapping your PLB for an InReach mini (100 grams), and it's easy to find one litre PET bottles that are only 40g.

But I will quibble that your fuel bottle (unlike the fuel itself) isn't really consumable. I tend to think of base weight as the weight of your pack when you finish the walk and have consumed whatever you are going to consume.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby crollsurf » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 8:49 am

ribuck wrote:That is truly impressive! You could save a bit more weight by swapping your PLB for an InReach mini (100 grams), and it's easy to find one litre PET bottles that are only 40g.

But I will quibble that your fuel bottle (unlike the fuel itself) isn't really consumable. I tend to think of base weight as the weight of your pack when you finish the walk and have consumed whatever you are going to consume.


Tempted to get an InReach mini, probably wait until this PLB reaches it's expiry date.
I was too lazy before to pour out the Metho to weigh the bottle, but for accuracy, I have now and updated :) Went to pack my bag this morning and realized I'd also forgotten a few things that I have now added, but have pushed my base weight over 3kg:
Sunnto Clip Compass (5g)
Sunscreen (62g) wasn't going to squeeze out all the cream to get the base weight
Sea to Summit Wilderness Wash (29g) same, wasn't going to empty
Bottle Hanging Buckle (18g)
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 8:53 am

Great list crollsurf!

How are you finding that 100g kathmandu poncho? robust enough? Im thinking of getting a cheap n light poncho for UL trips.

I assume you got the v1 one..
https://www.kathmandu.com.au/rain-poncho-pouch.html

the V2 is now weighing 200 grams :cry:
https://www.kathmandu.com.au/travel-rain-poncho-v2.html
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby crollsurf » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 10:02 am

wildwanderer wrote:Great list crollsurf!

How are you finding that 100g kathmandu poncho? robust enough? Im thinking of getting a cheap n light poncho for UL trips.

I assume you got the v1 one..
https://www.kathmandu.com.au/rain-poncho-pouch.html

the V2 is now weighing 200 grams :cry:
https://www.kathmandu.com.au/travel-rain-poncho-v2.html


It's the first one, the Rain Poncho Pouch, it's better and more durable than others of that type but I wouldn't recommend it. It's fine on fire trails, open country but wouldn't last long in scrub. If I could find a 10-20D ripstop Poncho that fitted me XX(X)L, I'd get that but haven't found one to date.
Overnighters that are looking like rain, I'll normally cancel and go another time but there are times I'll take my chances, especially if day 2 is looking good.
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby johnrs » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 11:34 am

Heh WW
How do you like the Nemo Tensor short?
Do you feel the dropoff at the short end?
And what sort of Colombia rain jacket do you have?
Thanks
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby wildwanderer » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 12:13 pm

johnrs wrote:Heh WW
How do you like the Nemo Tensor short?
Do you feel the dropoff at the short end?
And what sort of Colombia rain jacket do you have?
Thanks
John


Hi John,

I find the short version quite comfortable and it's virtually silent to sleep on. I'm 5'10 and it goes to mid thigh so as long as you have a CCF pad or your pack for the lower half the drop isn't that noticeable. My main issue with the Nemo tensor series is durability. Material is thin and easy to hole (I'm quite careful with gear but still managed to hole this twice while in the tent. I find the xlite more durable.

I have a Columbia outdry hooded jacket. Mine is an older model but it's quite similar to this one both have pit zips and front venting pockets.

https://www.columbia.com/p/mens-outdry- ... =030&pos=1
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Re: Overnight Ultralight Trip setup Challenge

Postby johnrs » Wed 10 Mar, 2021 3:11 pm

Thanks WW
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