NZ Kepler and Milford Sound walks

[wildernesswanderer]

I'm starting to plan our 3 week trip to NZ next year, and these two walks are on our list to do. Now never been to NZ before and not knowing all the conditions, I'm trying to work out time of year, I'm thinking early spring, maybe mid September. Are these tracks ok to do at this time, I want to avoid like the plague any holiday season in NZ as much as possible.

Any other good tracks that get into the souths Alpine regions I should look at.

[Strider]

Around June-October will be ski season - expect it to be extremely busy if you're going anywhere near Queenstown or Wanaka.

[wayno]

spring the weather can still be at its worst down there. often doesnt settle down till early to mid january, autumn can get a lot of settled weather but can get the odd pre winter storm but its generally more settled than spring....
it varies from year to year but spring usually isnt good, you can get snow storms at xmas... I go down most summers and more often than not theres a off crap weather up till new years and even after. thing is there are quotas on teh no's of people who can do those walks so it doesnt matter so much, the huts dont get over crowded once you have your booking.... the milford will be fully booked right through till autumn. not so the kepler...
fit the routeburn in if you can , i like it better than both of those walks... it's two to three days, its one way to get back to queenstown...
this spring the weather has been pretty bad in that neck of the woods. we've had a lot of storms go through, last summer wasnt the greatest either.
but autumn was brilliant and of course i was injured. cascade saddle is another great one, weather allowing... usually done as a fie day trp as part of the rees dart, or three and a half days as a through trip from wanaka through to glenorchy..
from what i can tell southern nz's weather is similar to tasmanias....

http://www.topomap.co.nz/

[wayno]

if you are styaing in queenstown the YHA lake front backpackers seems to attract its share of trampers. good place to compare notes,

[wayno]

plus in spring theres stil avalanche danger esp on the milford, can go through to oct - november
could need ice axe and campons esp on the kepler

http://www.doc.govt.nz/parks-and-recrea ... fiordland/

[wildernesswanderer]

Oh so late summer or autumn would be better. Looked at the Routeburn as well and if I can do all three I will but want to do Milford at least and one other. Will have to look into which one. Thanks

[wayno]

you can get a shuttle that will take you from milford sound onto the routeburn, you're pretty limited in what you can get in the way of food at milford sound though. otherwise its back to te anau then back up to the routeburn

[wayno]

south island forecasts

http://www.metservice.com/rural/southland

http://www.metservice.com/rural/westland

http://www.metservice.com/mountain/fior ... ional-park

http://www.mountain-forecast.com/peaks/ ... casts/1000

[geoskid]

you can get a shuttle that will take you from milford sound onto the routeburn, you're pretty limited in what you can get in the way of food at milford sound though. otherwise its back to te anau then back up to the routeburn

G'day Wayno, We're doing these two walks in January with a 2 night stopover at Milford Lodge (track transfer to Routeburn). I hav'nt yet looked into whether to carry food for the Routeburn from the start of Milford, or whether we could re-supply for the Routeburn at Milford Sound. Can you get basic bushwalk type food at Milford Sound, or would it be more suited to the people self catering in the accom. at the Lodge. I was assuming we would get something to survive on that was'nt too heavy.
What would Wayno do?

Cheers

[wayno]

the lodge is mainly for self catering. all i noticed when i stayed there was a bit of basic food for sale. and not a lot of it, the odd can or packet. I had my own food when i was there.
contact them. contact them and clarify whats there. i'm not aware that they will act like a post office and accept food shipped to them.
if you go back to te anau, its a shorter drive to get back to the routeburn, te anau has a full supermarket to shop your heart out at, its about 60 - 70k from the routeburn, not a massive drive....i'm coming off the kepler on jan 2nd and going onto the routeburn on the 4th from memory. routeburn was virtually booked out when i was booking it, i had to wait for a vacancy to get into the mackenzie,
falls and mackenzie huts which are the best ones arent available till the 1th and 12th of jan, you've have to do a longer day between howden and the flats otherwise if you're going earlier, i could only get into the flats hut on the 5th

[wayno]

this is where the routeburn goes in , zoom out and yo'll see milford sound to the west and te anau to the south...
its a scenic rd , won't hurt to take it back to te anau and back to the divide.

http://www.topomap.co.nz/NZTopoMap/nz19 ... /Southland

[wayno]

if you stay in te anau, under no circumstances should you miss the movie in the theatre "Ata Whenua", half hour video set to music of fiordland shot from helicopters by cameraman from lord of the rings, its absolutely stunning shows scenery you'll never get to see otherwise unless you pay a pilot mega bucks.. plays every hour. i watch it every time i go there even though i have the dvd as well.

if you stay in milford sound and you ahve a day to spare you can take an early morning kayak on the sound at 7am with roscoes well worth it, usually calmest in the morning it was like glass when i did it.
also just up the road is the tutoko valley, one of the most unknown and most scenic valleys i the world in good weather, more stunning than the milford track. a two hour walk gets you to a river flat where the mountains rise vertically for over two thousand metres mt tutoko hte highest peak in fiordland at 2700 metres and features in the ata whenua movie... few people go there because the track is rough but the bush is stunning.

[wayno]

removed

[forest]

I would agree with Wayno that Sept will still be to early.

We attempted the Routeburn in the first week of the official walk season (Nov) and were tunred back at Lake Mackenzie Hut as they were aerial bombing the Harris Saddle section to clear the avalanch danger area's. The DOCs office couldn't give us a definative answer before setting off the day before weather the track would be cleared or not

I completed the remaining portion of the Routeburn in April this year and couldn't recommend it highly enough. A lot of people were tieing the Milford and Routeburn in together.

I would also recommend doing the Milford followed by the Routeburn.

The Kiwi transfer companies are so, so helpful. You could probably organise your transfers to the start of the Milford track and have the company drop a prepackaged (You would need to make it up) load of food down at Milford Sound if you know where you will be staying. It's quite simple to get a short transfer from Mildford Sound back to the Divide (Start/Finish of the Routeburn Track). I would recommend that option as it puts you back on the Queenstown side of the mountains.

I'm not sure where you are basing yourselves at or what your transpot arrangements are. Just remember it's quite a long drive from Queenstown to Te Anau / Milford Sound. The drive from Queenstown down the the Start of the Routeburn track near Glenorchy is only about 1hr.

[geoskid]

Thanks Wayno,
Yeah, I think we'll carry the food for The Routeburn, that way the whole thing is organised to the end of the Routeburn, before we set foot on the Milford Track. We pre-booked with Tracknet to get us from Milford Sound to The Divide. They are both not long walks really - 3nights on Milford, 2 nights on Routeburn, so not a huge amount of food.

Looking at the map you linked to, I noticed the Dore Pass access to Clinton Hut. Are you aware of many locals using this access in suitable conditions to avoid the fairly expensive boat ride from Te-Anau Downs?

Have you got any local knowledge of side-trips, POI's on the Milford Track & Routeburn Track that don't make it onto Parks tourist literature?


Cheers

[wayno]

doc get pretty antzsy about avalanche warning. even the slightest avalanche risk and doc bring in teh hekicopters in walking season when the numbers are enough,usually when the guided walkers are brining in the helicopter anyway...., i know people who were told they ahd to pay $80 for a helicopter to get past harris bluffs and htey just ignored them. but thre cvan be severe danger there over winter and into spring, most avalanches happen in storms or the heat of the day when the snow melts
i think theres less avalnche risk round the other side of lake harris opposite the bluffs but theres no track and there are bluffs you have to work out how to get around, its not an easy trip and not for anyone not experienced at steep terrain off track. and doc are banned from offering any information that isnt on one of their official tracks after a claims that a warden gave someone information about a shortcut which the person subsequently took and died on.
harris bluffs are the biggest problem with the routeburn in spring, its a relatively short section of a few hundred metres you can get through pretty quickly.

[wayno]

i dont know of anyone doing dorre pass. i've seldom heard of it being used. it's a steep high pass, exposed to any bad weather, it should be avoided in bad weather. two things in fiordland to avoid, steep walks off track on sleek rock or tussock in the wet, easy to slip to your death. it would be one of the biggest killers in that area....
thers not much off the milford thats easy to get to.
off the routeburn depends how determined you are, theres emily pass but i wouldnt do it in that direction, its easy to go wrong and get stuck.
sugarloaf pass a high steep walk. the north routeburn valley, straight forward till the upper reaches.
the great walks in fiordland are to a certain extent cut off from connecting to many other tracks and have been built in isolation in the case of kepler and milford

[geoskid]

Agree about the transfer companies Forest, very easy to organise. Can't vouch for reliability yet, but hav'nt heard anything negative. I guess they get the numbers of walkers to be able to provide such a good service.

We will be based in Queenstown, arrive there the night before starting Milford. Tracknet pick us up in morning at Q'town, call into Te-Anau and pick up tickets for Milford, take us to boat at Te-Anau Downs. Transfer between Milford and Routeburn 6 days later( 2 nights Milford Sound), pick up at Routeburn Shelter 3 days later and take us back to Q'town.
Too easy, thank you very much!

[wayno]

i'd avoid info and track as much as possible.
there's buckleys but they dont go to and from milford sound, only as far as divide
info and track have a compulsory stop for half an hour that hoses me off, to and from the shelter on the routeburn the trip isnt nearly long enough to warrant the stop off other than to make more money for the shop they stop you at,
buckleys will pick you up and drop you off at your accomodation in queenstown or te anau. and can leave earlier.... the info and track vehicles are old clapped out noisy, they drivers can be incredibly rude.

[sef]

Dore Pass is fairly well used, but is at a very different standard from the rest of the Milford Track. DOC classify it as a "route", you should be able to read the difference between their classifications at: http://www.doc.govt.nz/parks-and-recrea ... ategories/

As to side trips, if you are comfortable with off trail travel in that part of the world you can get up Mt Hart from Mackinnon Pass with care (Milford), or on the Routeburn it is possible to head up to Emily Pass/Fraser Col from Lake Mackenzie (as wayno has said, the other side requires nav attention, take a guess at the origins of the "Israeli Ck" marked on the topo -- a few hours trip up past the lake to either would be straightforward though) or Ocean Peak/Xeneticus from Harris Saddle.

[wayno]

be very aware of the weather if you're planning side trips... doesnt matter how nice the weather is, bad weather can come in rapidly, be sure of the forecast and dont treat it as the gospel. be on the lookout for bad weather. the rock can be slick in the rain and tussock slippery in the wet....
you're almost guaranteed rain at some stage.... one day in three of rain is pretty good weather.....

this is the routeburn in mid summer the day before was blazing sun,,, at times i couldnt stand upright in the wind http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utS1J0ubi90&feature=plcp

vhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=N8 ... =endscreen

[wayno]

BEFORE ROUTEBRN FALLS ON YOUR WAY DOWN , to the right you can climb up to some lakes with a geat view a hundred metres above. nice quiet spot to go to in the afternoon