Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

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Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby lawrence » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 9:09 am

Trying to expand my dinners past freeze dried food, and want to try some actual cooking, but just simple stuff.
Should pre-packaged salami from Woolies be safe to bring on a short hike (for example just a 3 day, 2 night trip) during Summer here?

From what I've read on here and numerous other hiking sites, people always say to get the salami that's hanging in the delis as it doesn't require refrigeration, but say I wanted to be lazy and cheap and just buy some of these logs:
https://www.woolworths.com.au/shop/prod ... garian-hot
https://www.woolworths.com.au/shop/prod ... ami-danish

The packaging says store between 0-4 °C, but they're also sealed and not pre-sliced.. so I figure they could be good to go, especially for a shorter trip right?

Also - what cheese does everyone usually go for? I assume the hard aged type or the triangle soft cheeses.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Orion » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 9:21 am

This is one of those recurring questions. If you search you'll find all the same answers you're probably about to get.

Despite the ominous label warning about maintaining refrigeration, many bushwalkers have carried those salamis (Don and, I forget the other brand I like better) on trips lasting many days without GI issues. I had some in a food cache earlier this year and ate the last parts of one about three weeks after it left the refrigerator. That's unopened though. Once exposed to air they do seem to have a more limited life.

In the same vein, I don't worry about any cheese over a period of about a week. The really soft, stinky ones can lose some of their je ne sais quoi, but I can't recall ever having one go completely off. Harder cheeses in cooler weather can last for a long time. Packaged string mozzarella seems to be particularly indestructible, as does packaged grated/shredded cheese for pasta. I just came across an opened package of shredded Parmesan that I'd forgotten to get rid of after a trip in early September. It was in a ziplock, but it had been opened and partly used. It looked and smelled just fine. I tossed it out -- it had been sitting in a pile next to my bushwalking clothes and gear for over two months -- but I think it was actually okay. I'd have eaten it on a trip.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby CasualNerd » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 9:30 am

The cheap cabana that smells smoked actually lasts really well if you hang it outside, shrivels up a bit like salami but lasts for weeks outside the fridge. I only tried because a local deli was doing it and they never had problems either.

Like many people I think if you use your nose you can tell when something's properly off - until then just enjoy it, assuming you've got a strong stomach to begin with.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby crollsurf » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 9:59 am

Go to your local Deli, if it's hanging and not in the fridge, it will be what your after.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby lawrence » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 11:26 am

Orion wrote:Packaged string mozzarella seems to be particularly indestructible, as does packaged grated/shredded cheese for pasta.


Really even those pre-shredded ones? That's good to know, I find them much easier to just drop into a meal as opposed to chopping up blocks of cheese.

Sounds like the salami should be no problem then, thanks all :D
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Mark F » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 12:06 pm

If you are keeping it for more than a couple of days unrefrigerated only ever get it unsliced. The more exposed surface area the greater the risk of bugs etc. Same for cheese.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Rosscodj » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 12:11 pm

Hans striker sticks are shelf stable. It's even printed on the packet. Handy thing is you only open up what you're about to use and leave the other ones sealed.
The downside is they can be a little pricey.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby photohiker » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 1:54 pm

lawrence wrote:
Orion wrote:Packaged string mozzarella seems to be particularly indestructible, as does packaged grated/shredded cheese for pasta.


Really even those pre-shredded ones? That's good to know, I find them much easier to just drop into a meal as opposed to chopping up blocks of cheese.

Sounds like the salami should be no problem then, thanks all :D


We have tried shredded cheese from the supermarket.

They use a system added to the shredded cheese called ‘anti-caking’ stuff to keep the cheese from sticking together. Test them before taking them for the trip. They made us run to the toilet. Never use shredded cheese again, just blocks of cheese and all fine.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Lamont » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 4:47 pm

You say summer-what temps? What's summer for you?
On a "20 degree day" it is about 25C in the sun. Checked last weekend with my accurate fridge thermometer.
You could not pay me to carry any of that "salami meat product" they sell in the deli, in the "heat"- about 18+
My daughter brought a nice case of salmonella home from Cambodia from eating meat not kept in a constant cool temp. Sitting in Geelong hospital quarantined for a couple of days was quite a trial for her.
Nor would I eat any soft cheese (milk product) either if it was for more than about 24 hours at those temps. Really what's the point?
It would have so much crap in it to preserve it why bother.
"Shelf Life" also does not assume outdoors warm and varying temps, but a nice constant temp of about 12-18 I believe-on a shelf in a house/shop.
I get home and have a grass fed T-bone steak cooked on charcoal. Or you might carry it in frozen and eat it on your first night!
Under 20 and cool overnight I will take a punt but eat it quickly. Something like biltong, procciuto, jerky, lebanese basturma, or local pastrami maybe, very lean and very well air dried. Slice it as you want it.
That (soft triangle Laughing cow "milk product" ) goes for cheese as well-I won't bother or risk it. Hard dry and stable pecorino, grana, yep.
Instead, why not get home and make a delicious cheese tart with some Gruyere.
Don't grate your cheese -eat it in slices/bites with your meal, shepherd style.
Get some tuna in an air tight single sachet times as many as you want for protein.
Best still make a beeline for the best eatery and treat yourself to a good meal on the way home! And why not on the way as well!
Now if you wanted to carry a chilly bin and some slicka pads...........
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby andrewa » Mon 19 Nov, 2018 7:12 pm

My regular experience with salamis like this is 10 day NZ fly fishing trips in summer ( temps normally <25C).

We normally take 3 supermarket salamis, with which we have never had any problems over 12 years, and 3 blocks of Parmesan, same deal.

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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby davidf » Mon 26 Nov, 2018 2:20 pm

I,ve actually had better luck with pre packaged than the deli stuff. The deli stuff is made for a controlled enviroment. The pre sliced packaged stuff works well for longer walks as its not open for long between serves.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Huntsman247 » Mon 26 Nov, 2018 6:05 pm

Store bought stuff has enough chemicals to preserve it that you don't really need to worry about it perishing...

I make my own to avoid the nasties and I only refrigerate it to stop the meat from drying out too much. Without smoking or chemicals meat will last for a very long time unrefrigerated as long as not in damp humid conditions and COMMON SENSE is used in preparing and storing it. It will just dry out eventually.

For example prosciutto is made by hanging the meat in a dry environment for around 3-5 months unrefrigerated. It doesn't go off and tastes amazing.

I wouldn't worry about store bought stuff going off.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby CasualNerd » Tue 27 Nov, 2018 10:20 am

Huntsman247 wrote:For example prosciutto is made by hanging the meat in a dry environment for around 3-5 months unrefrigerated. It doesn't go off and tastes amazing.


Most cured meats require a minimum amount of salt or other curing agents to preserve, it sounds like you're suggesting hanging a leg of pork for months is safe.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Huntsman247 » Tue 27 Nov, 2018 11:50 am

CasualNerd wrote:
Huntsman247 wrote:For example prosciutto is made by hanging the meat in a dry environment for around 3-5 months unrefrigerated. It doesn't go off and tastes amazing.


Most cured meats require a minimum amount of salt or other curing agents to preserve, it sounds like you're suggesting hanging a leg of pork for months is safe.


I'm just using that as an example. That with just minimal natural ingredients which includes salt meat it's pretty easy to keep and for it not to go off. I didn't provide a recipe.
My point is that store bought stuff has much more potent chemical preservatives that you don't need to be paranoid about processed meat going off if meat with minimal natural preservatives like bit of salt preserves really easily without refrigeration for months. It's surprising even how little salt you actually need.

No need to read things into what I said.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby CasualNerd » Tue 27 Nov, 2018 9:39 pm

Huntsman247 wrote:No need to read things into what I said.


No offense intended, just clarifying for those that might not know better.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby wildwanderer » Fri 30 Nov, 2018 12:24 pm

I generally buy the hans striker ones. They are designed for lunchboxes and say on the packet keep in a cool dry place. eg no refridgeration required.
So likely they will keep for weeks/months.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby flingebunt » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 10:15 am

This is the problem I have with this type of discussion. People talk about how processed meats, including bacon should last. However modern manufacturing processes means that they are made for flavour more than lasting without refrigeration. People say things like "Oh, I bought bacon and salami and it lasted a long time."

But please please please, tell me the details. The brand and the specific type of meat. This will help me buy that specific product.

By the way, if you go to the markets you find people who sell non-refrigerated processed meats. This is the best place to buy for camping.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby CBee » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 12:56 pm

Salami air dried need to be stored at lower temp. Very hard if not impossible to find a product free of preservatives. Smaller manufacturers who supplies delis, have usually different products dried for a variety of times, so buying the drier one, is almost like taking with you biltong or jerky. If you are looking for a product who has a decent degree of quality and taste, look for a small cacciatore salami (hot or mild). Go to the deli and ask for one very hard. It will sweat a bit in your pack, but it will last easily a week, if is not too warm outside.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Trundlers » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 2:48 pm

http://www.borgo.com - haven't tried this one but they seem to air dry, so you might need to research more.
https://schultes.com.au - have eaten mettwurst stored/purchased at room temp in the past. Not recently though.
Air dried, fermented (something to do with lactic acid fermentation) and properly cured salami/salumi might survive ok without substantial degradation. Extreme heat will make the fat run, and probably send it off. Fat goes rancid in the heat and is not good to consume. Schultes make a nice reasonably shelf stable salami (have purchased this in the past haning up well away from any fridge) Hunt around for small producers. Some servos have local salami type products for sale (vac sealed at room temp). Salting and curing meat has changed due to health regs over the decades. Far less salt and short curing times mean most processed meats need refrigeration and won't keep very long. Biltong and jerky and friends probably a safer option in a hot environment.

Ultimately, play it safe with processed meat products. Food poisoning on the track would be best avoided. :shock:

*edited
Last edited by Trundlers on Sun 13 Jan, 2019 5:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby flingebunt » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 5:18 pm

Trundlers wrote:http://www.borgo.com.au
https://schultes.com.au
Air dried, fermented (something to do with lactic acid fermentation) and properly cured salami/salumi might survive ok without substantial degradation. Extreme heat will make the fat run, and probably send it off. Fat goes rancid in the heat and is not good to consume. Schultes make a nice reasonably shelf stable salami. Hunt around for small producers. Some servos have local salami type products for sale. Salting and curing meat has changed due to health regs over the decades. Far less salt and short curing times mean most processed meats need refrigeration and won't keep very long. Biltong and jerky and friends probably a safer option in a hot environment.


Fantastic, I will look out for those brands.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Neo » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 8:00 pm

If I have a fridge or if I can shop the morning of a bushwalk, one of my favourites is a little fancy steak with a $2 bagged coleslaw or couscous for the first night. Balsamic glaze as the dressing.

Can also get a pre roasted chook boob vac packed in the regular meat section of coles for $7. Good for first lunch, dinner that night, if any left over day 3 then fry it a bit...

Day two and beyond, ANY cured/precooked meat should be fine, especially if cooked a little before eating. Should be safe enough kept out of the sun too.

If you really need it, canned or packet meat/fish beyond that. I don't eat fish and usually go vego from day 3.

Second/third day Brie is some of the best I've had! Super soft and gooey.

Just lived 18mths on the road without a fridge and planning the same for this year. Usually near shops so pick up something in the arvo. Leftovers for brunch or recook/reinvented for the next evening. Have even recooked at least third day on a few occasions without illness.

Will be getting into a bit more dahl and vego this year.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Mark F » Sat 12 Jan, 2019 8:09 pm

flingebunt wrote:This is the problem I have with this type of discussion. People talk about how processed meats, including bacon should last. However modern manufacturing processes means that they are made for flavour more than lasting without refrigeration. People say things like "Oh, I bought bacon and salami and it lasted a long time."

But please please please, tell me the details. The brand and the specific type of meat. This will help me buy that specific product.


People can only tell you of their own experiences. How long a salami or similar will last depends on many factors - storage temperature, humidity, type of processing and preservatives, ingredients etc plus your degree of risk aversion. Ultimately there is only your own experience to fall back on. Nobody can say this one will last x days at y degrees and z% humidity. The rules of thumb are the drier (usually the longer it has been hanging) the better it will last. The higher the temperature and humidity the shorter its life span. What you want for walking will differ from what you put in a food drop. Food drops, because of the container tend to more anoxic so you are dealing with different bacteria compared to something in your pack.

I don't use much salami in Australia any more but in France I happily carry a nice dry sanglier saucisson (wild boar salami) for a week or more and these are available just about everywhere in the alpine villages. For food drops I have found the pasturised, uncut and plastic wrapped salamis will last several weeks to months in a food drop and a week or so once opened.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Trundlers » Sun 13 Jan, 2019 5:57 am

https://www.csiro.au/en/Research/Health ... ting-foods
Point 2 under grocery shopping tips mentions parmesan and salami.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby matagi » Sun 13 Jan, 2019 7:52 am

Salami is ok if you buy the stuff that is hanging up unrefrigerated - the stuff from the supermarket fridge I would treat with caution. Parmesan - make sure it is Italian and wrap it in oiled greaseproof paper to help stop it drying out too much.
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Re: Supermarket salami vs Deli salami

Postby Outbeck » Tue 15 Jan, 2019 2:14 pm

+ 1 Hans Striker salami sticks.
I have used it in food drops and not got to it for a month.
Never had a problem. The individual portions work well.
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