Bushfire season 2019-2020

[ribuck]

I was planning a Budawangs trip for yesterday and the day before, but that got closed. Then I planned to head out from Bell into some nice moist canyons, but they got closed. So my wife and I ended up doing a very dry trip down Matadoro Ridge to Wineglass Tor in the Shoalhaven area. At least the air was fresh and clean. The smoky air was so striking coming back into Sydney.

[jonnosan]

Is it correct to say that there is currently nowhere legal and safe to go bushwalking anywhere in the blue mountains? as far as I can ascertain, all of the tracks (even ones that are well away from any current fire) within the national park are officially closed, cant really see that changing for a long time either. I was planning on going down to the snowies for new years, hopefully that will still be possible.

[Warin]

Is it correct to say that there is currently nowhere legal and safe to go bushwalking anywhere in the blue mountains?

Safe? Sorry but your level of risk vs safety my differ from mine. So that you should evaluate yourself.

Legally? Well my local National Park bands walking at any time there is a total fire ban. Other parks may do the same in NSW. I expect all the NSW parks will eventually to cover their legal backsides. In the mean time what parts are closed is on their website.

[jonnosan]

yeah probably not a well worded question, will rephrase as "is anyone willing to recommend on a public forum anywhere that is within 2 hrs drive of katoomba I could go for 2 to 6 hr walk somewhere before xmas?"

I expect the answer will be no, but figured its worth a punt as my mind and body would both benefit from a bit of time spent out in the bush.

EDIT: actually I worked out what I really should be doing here - I am going to see how I can help out with the local RFS.

[Grabeach]

If your have trouble determining where fire lines on the RFS map actually are, it may be useful to note that the RFS map and SIX Maps use the same scales. If you can find a known point (eg. creek junction , property boundary corner) you can set them up the two maps to occupy the same space on your monitor and tab between the two. To the accuracy of the RFS data, you can determine how far the fire is from anything visible on the SIX air photos. Of particular interest to me was that the Kowmung (Kanangra) fire is currently 200m SE from the CBC Shack chapel on Scotts Main Range.

[Neo]

Jonosan the Gardens of Stone maaay still be an option.
Could check out Abercrombie NP for a walk.
Could also go for state forests. I dislike radiata pine but it can be surreal walking in a monoculture. If your licky you might find an arboretum!

[Lophophaps]

I recently read that park managers like to know who is in the more remote parts of the park so that if there's a fire they can attempt to evacuate such people. Should park managers be advised of intentions?

[ribuck]

is anyone willing to recommend on a public forum anywhere that is within 2 hrs drive of katoomba I could go for 2 to 6 hr walk somewhere before xmas?

Yes! The Grand Canyon loop near Blackheath is explicitly exempted from the closures. Three hours or so of walking, 15 minutes' drive from Katoomba.

Further afield, viable options seem to be the north part of Morton NP, plus all of Deua NP and the Snowy Mountains. I'm off to Bungonia Gorge tomorrow morning, having returned yesterday from two days on the Shoalhaven at Wineglass Tor.

[jonnosan]

Yes! The Grand Canyon loop near Blackheath is explicitly exempted from the closures. Three hours or so of walking, 15 minutes' drive from Katoomba.

Thanks, I hadn't realized that was still open! Have done it a few times before but will fit the bill nicely I think.

[Neo]

I'd suspected the whole country would burn this summer given the record high temps and lack of rainfall in recent years. Also my auto observations of the bush and condition of plants. Overall they have smaller and less foliage.

Some spots I've been, the regrowth hasnt kicked on or 'blossomed' even 5 years from fire

On a positive note I caught a bit of the recent Gardening Australia episode with a segment on a Melbourne golf course. They have some native sections, after a burn a few orchids and others popped up, some they didn't have knowledge of being there.

[jonnosan]

I can confirm that as of today at least, the grand canyon loop is open (even the abseil it seems judging from the number of folks I saw with wetsuits and ropes) and once you are below the cliffs the air is very pleasant.

[Neo]

Ppssibly the only canyon that can take the guided tours at the moment. I dont see why Empress would be off though.

[jonnosan]

According to https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/vi ... cal-alerts the only Grand Canyon is the only one open:

All remote walking tracks, canyons and rock climbing descending below cliffs out of Mount Wilson, Bell, Green Gully, south of Katoomba to Woodford and into the Grose Valley (excluding Grand Canyon).


That page also says all the Wentworth Falls tracks are also closed.

According to BMCC list, https://www.bmcc.nsw.gov.au/walking-tracks, all walks (other than Darwins walk) between Katoomba and Wentworth Falls are closed but I am not sure of the status of walks on BMCC crown land that are outside of the national parks e.g. North Lawson/South Lawson waterfall circuits, Florabella pass, Terrace Falls.

[wildwanderer]

Track closures are a sensible precaution I think.

That gospers mtn juggernaut has me concerned. It's now only 12 km from bilpin and the bells line of road.

And its about to join with the three mile fire which is now about 7km from mount white on the central coast.

I don't think our government leadership state or federal has comprehended just how serious this bushfire situation is.

[Huntsman247]

Seems like mt currockbilly in the Budawangs has burnt according to the rfs app. Hope the logbook survives.

[LachlanB]

Seems like mt currockbilly in the Budawangs has burnt according to the rfs app. Hope the logbook survives.

They both survived the 2013 fire, so hopefully both logbooks will be ok this time around too. Worryingly, the fire has also spotted up around Yadboro Flat and is nearly to Long Gully. Looks like it's gonna escape into the main part of the Budawangs soon ):

[Grabeach]

LachlanB - I'm not an expert on emoticons, but doesn't a closing bracket signify happy? Ref. Wikipedia.

[MrWalker]

LachlanB - I'm not an expert on emoticons, but doesn't a closing bracket signify happy? Ref. Wikipedia.

Normally you read emoticons with your head tilted to the left, but Wikipedia says they can be written so you read them with your head tilted right. Just look for where the eyes are. That is definitely a frown.

[Grabeach]

Thanks, MrWalker.
Always wondered why a majority seemed to be unhappy with me .... and I guess I'm lucky I never used them!

[Huntsman247]

Seems like mt currockbilly in the Budawangs has burnt according to the rfs app. Hope the logbook survives.

They both survived the 2013 fire, so hopefully both logbooks will be ok this time around too. Worryingly, the fire has also spotted up around Yadboro Flat and is nearly to Long Gully. Looks like it's gonna escape into the main part of the Budawangs soon ):

Yeah it's getting pretty darn close to the castle. Hopefully Friday might bring rain.

[LachlanB]

LachlanB - I'm not an expert on emoticons, but doesn't a closing bracket signify happy? Ref. Wikipedia.

People do them both ways around, but colon first is by far the more common variant. To me, they don't make as much sense as ): and (: as the identifying part of the emoticon in this case is bracket, and we read left to right, and I at least tilt my head a little to the right as I read. Either way, my ): was definitely a sad face! And Grabeach, they are handy (along with emoji) to try and convey emotions along with plain text..

Huntsman, hopefully rain comes on Friday, and it isn't too late till then. It's scary that RFS is confidently predicting that the Gospers Mtn Fire will potentially burn for months more,,

[mandragara]

Very bad smoke in Sydney today. Did everyone cope?

I took the day off work.

[GregG]

Despite the best efforts of the RFS last night, the Ruined Castle fire has now crossed Narrow Neck and gotten into the eastern reaches of the Megalong. Hope back burns can stop it there. *&%$#! hell.

[wildwanderer]

Despite the best efforts of the RFS last night, the Ruined Castle fire has now crossed Narrow Neck and gotten into the eastern reaches of the Megalong. Hope back burns can stop it there. *&%$#! hell.

The kanangra-boyd fire is almost at the Cox and continuing to move northward.

I'm really concerned these mega fires are unstoppable in the current conditions.

Good to see atleast one politician broke ranks yesterday and saw the writing on the wall. The rest are still day dreaming thinking this is a normal summer.

It's time for the PM to call a national emergency. More resources,throw everything at these fires. At least give a chance to stop them.

Look at the rfs map in satellite view.. there are huge fires on the east coast inching closer to major population centres.

What's the plan to stop them?

There is no foreseeable significant rain coming

[wildwanderer]

As an example of more resources.

The ADF has 12 Hercules aircraft. With the installation of a temporary firefighting kit (multiple are in storage in US and other countries) it can dispense 11,000 litres.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modular ... ing_System

There was design work by two RMIT guys on a temporary kit for the C17 of which the ADF has 8. The kit can dispense 50,000 litres.
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... Operations

This is some info on what we have currently available. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-15/ ... s/11705502

https://fireaviation.com/2018/11/28/aus ... resources/

[LachlanB]

As an example of more resources.

The ADF has 12 Hercules aircraft. With the installation of a temporary firefighting kit (multiple are in storage in US and other countries) it can dispense 11,000 litres.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modular ... ing_System

There was design work by two RMIT guys on a temporary kit for the C17 of which the ADF has 8. The kit can dispense 50,000 litres.
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... Operations

This is some info on what we have currently available. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-15/ ... s/11705502

https://fireaviation.com/2018/11/28/aus ... resources/

Yes, but according to the government by using ADF aircraft for firefighting 'you may be selling Australia's national security, putting it at risk'.
https://www.9news.com.au/national/warni ... b3971d700e

When will these tools that call themselves a government wake up and realise that Australia's national security IS at risk from the climate emergency

[Wollemi]

This photo-document on facebook shows much military support.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... =1&__xts__[0]=68.ARCUvjejJcDIMKmEiqO8sz9bjjIHStf-8-3yzteZnycSkQk9ZsDmF2MesfCu08SqryXaAGfyEv_Dq1ZPSpzZGHEs4MruDK0CeCM8X1gPIanx0cyex5dSTeKMT1aUOpnwFeJ0NZGiHq6SDc_zNRCsdf9a2BloFFDHGFGuz2pShX9YG8De2K2biWsp7PpuOdzNeTHLEweyqDfgjnrno4Jf7UihDj3fSTvJOsBdQvsdeGxybiA3qG0xUmX_h7RJ8dozmpxeZ8AcfJ-dAQBwvq7cSzjfpKjjUF95KDjG3lDRBEEurLPa_eBruWQfne0R5efj_-2TkswK_g_dmIS9rXSOWtZoqukEM0HmOesTOEiQqBuzvp0FGTvgr_atTqAjBX0JoQjd7y3wlG9eNrMPTSYGnc4NoaPuaRPB1Hw6ih0AEyZbnvafkrqEOC3Aj8k40JuwaMWNnmaTrWLj551R1RHDYVmlKw&__tn__=HH-R

[Lophophaps]

A few weeks ago there was a high-level report saying that it's no longer climate change, it's a climate emergency. It very much seems that our purported "federal government" will only wake up to this when there is a huge weight of evidence. The increasing number of adverse events, their duration and their intensity will slowly percolate through the federal government miasma. Increasing economic impact due to the climate emergency may make them wake up. If there is no environment there is no economy - simple. Or life and lifestyle depends on 100 mm of soil with good nutrients, potable water, clean seas, biodiversity and clean air. If you live in Sydney you know about the latter.

[LachlanB]

This photo-document on facebook shows much military support.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... =1&__xts__[0]=68.ARCUvjejJcDIMKmEiqO8sz9bjjIHStf-8-3yzteZnycSkQk9ZsDmF2MesfCu08SqryXaAGfyEv_Dq1ZPSpzZGHEs4MruDK0CeCM8X1gPIanx0cyex5dSTeKMT1aUOpnwFeJ0NZGiHq6SDc_zNRCsdf9a2BloFFDHGFGuz2pShX9YG8De2K2biWsp7PpuOdzNeTHLEweyqDfgjnrno4Jf7UihDj3fSTvJOsBdQvsdeGxybiA3qG0xUmX_h7RJ8dozmpxeZ8AcfJ-dAQBwvq7cSzjfpKjjUF95KDjG3lDRBEEurLPa_eBruWQfne0R5efj_-2TkswK_g_dmIS9rXSOWtZoqukEM0HmOesTOEiQqBuzvp0FGTvgr_atTqAjBX0JoQjd7y3wlG9eNrMPTSYGnc4NoaPuaRPB1Hw6ih0AEyZbnvafkrqEOC3Aj8k40JuwaMWNnmaTrWLj551R1RHDYVmlKw&__tn__=HH-R

The military iscertainly involved in logistical efforts to combat the fires. I agree with the comments along the lines of that, on the ground, this is the best place for them to be involved, as it doesn't get in the rode of RFS' and NPWS' core fire-fighting capabilities. It also frees some of NPWS' and RFS' manpower for frontline fire-fighting and hopefully more rotations away from the fire-areas.

However, the country owns many Globemaster and Hercules aircraft, that as Wildwanderer's links indicate, can be quickly and temporarily transformed into tanker aircraft. Sure, some of them are being used to shuttle people around to help combat the fires, and this is a good thing. But considering that Australia doesn't have enough large firefighting aircraft (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-15/ ... s/11705502), it would be a good way to further utilise military assets for a critically important purpose (firefighting).

[wildwanderer]

Some good news.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-12/ ... t/11790862

Hopefully they can lease some more air assets from the northern hemisphere quickly.

It's a pity it took so long. According to news reports this funding request was submitted to the federal govt 2 years ago... (As indicated in LachlanB's above link)