Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

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Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sat 09 Feb, 2013 12:08 am

Hey,

I was recently reading through some historical info on the SBW website when I came across something mentioning a search for a plane that had crashed into Mt Guouogang.

Does anyone know if a plane crash site does exist in that region, and does anyone have any further information regarding the site?

I would be very interested in trying to locate it if I could track down some leads first, I'd say it would be a difficult area to search without the relevant info!
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Sat 09 Feb, 2013 5:39 pm

I'm not aware of it and have never seen any evidence of it. not heard that one before?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby FatCanyoner » Sat 09 Feb, 2013 8:48 pm

There's a WW2 plane crash in the Blue Mountains that I know of, on the south side of the mid-mountains. I don't know of anything near Guouogang though.

I also recall a more recent light plane crashing somewhere near Christies Ck. Hopefully Dave Noble spots this as he knows that story well.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sat 09 Feb, 2013 9:03 pm

I had another search through the web and an edition of "The Bushwalker" mentioned a crash site on the nearby Mt Queahgong. Not sure if it is regarding the same plane.

The Christies Ck site would be interesting, plus it would give me another excuse to go and walk a fair portion of the Creek - It just looks like spectacular territory!
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby FatCanyoner » Sat 09 Feb, 2013 10:38 pm

This is the crash report for the one I mentioned. I believe Dave was one of the bushwalkers that saw the plane flying low through Christies Creek: https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/in ... 03121.aspx
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby DaveNoble » Sun 10 Feb, 2013 6:17 pm

FatCanyoner wrote:This is the crash report for the one I mentioned. I believe Dave was one of the bushwalkers that saw the plane flying low through Christies Creek: https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/in ... 03121.aspx


No - I didn't see that plane (although another member of the party did, but thought nothing much off it later on - since the press report of the missing plane in the SMH had the day wrong)

The plane crash near Guouogang is quite well known - I haven't seen the wreckage, (and I have been out that way a fair bit) but friends have, its nearer to Queahgong or perhaps Hawkfell - and on the western side of the range - not too far down from the ridge line. I think it would still be quite easy to find. I think it dates back from WWII or the 50's.

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sun 10 Feb, 2013 11:24 pm

Tim - That report was interesting, especially that they initially survived and made it to Wheengee Whungee Creek as well as the incorrect Newspaper report details.

Dave - Thanks for the information! I will be heading that way within the month so I'll have a look to see what I can find. Do you know of anyone else that might be able to provide me with some extra info?
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sun 10 Feb, 2013 11:44 pm

Would this be the one you are referring to?

At first light, we broke camp, crossed the Coxs River and made for Mt. Guougang. The climb up over the Krungle Bungle Range was very long and slow and very scrubby. On the narrow ridgeline of Mt. Queahgong, we discovered a recent plane wreck. One wing was poking up out of the side of the ridge. The surrounding vegetation was burnt and the fuselage was just a lump of fused metal.

Sourced from an SUBW "Girls Gasping Through The Gangerangs" Trip Report.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby ainemrg » Mon 11 Feb, 2013 7:10 am

I, my husband and two children were camped at the junction of Christies and the Kowmung with a group from The Upper Blue Mountains Bushwalking Club. On Sunday morning, in low cloud, we saw a plane fly overhead and up Christies Creek. Further down the Kowmung were a group from Springwood Bushwalking Club. Michael (Ted) Maack was with them. They also saw the plane. Both groups subsequently saw a report in the paper which said the plane had gone missing on the Saturday. We both incorrectly concluded that the plane we had seen was a search plane. Later we and Ted were required to attend the inquest. Prior to this my husband and I went with the Coroner in a Police helicopter to show him the location we had seen the plane. Sadly Ted passed away last year.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby melinda » Thu 14 Feb, 2013 6:01 pm

Hi Alex,
A few years ago I was part of a group of SBW members (led by 'Killer Miller' ) who were training for a 3 peaks attempts. We were doing a lot of walks on the Krungle Bungles, and there abouts.
On one walk to Quougang Karl was hunting around for a plane that had supposedly crashed there in the early 60's. Needless to say we didn't find it but the story appealed to me so I started searching for more info.
Various internet searches led me to the Press On Regardless (SUBW) article "Girls Gasping Through The Gangerangs" by Denise Black and Carol Isaacs. (A great read!)
http://www.subw.org.au/archives/POR/Gasping.html
As you quoted, the article says:
"On the narrow ridgeline of Mt. Queahgong, we discovered a recent plane wreck. One wing was poking up out of the side of the ridge. The surrounding vegetation was burnt and the fuselage was just a lump of fused metal. Carol remembered that this plane had crashed about twelve months prior to our trip and it had taken the police a long time to find it."
So, we had a very rough location.
I started asking mates for info and a friend from Sutherland Bushwalkers told me she had been there a few years ago.
So more questions were asked and we narrowed the location down to a pretty specific point.
We went in from Kanangra Rd, Paralyzer, Quouogang and then down Hawksfell to Mt Queahgong. (Probably easier going in from Carlons)
On the south side of Queahgong we started looking around quite closely and after a few false starts we found the plane.
Rather poignant moment. This plane was so close to clearing the ridge but just didn't make it!
Send me a private message if you need more info.
Last edited by melinda on Sun 17 Feb, 2013 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Fri 15 Feb, 2013 8:32 am

Dear Melinda,

That is fascinating. In all my years of walking in that area I had never even heard of this plane crash. Does anyone know of the circumstances? There must be an official record somehwere?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Fri 15 Feb, 2013 10:40 am

Melinda - Good to hear you actually tracked it down in the end.

Kanangra - I had a look through the Australian Transport Safety Bureau website and they don't seem to have any reports as old as the the suspected time of the crash. Maybe another government body handled that sort of stuff in the 60s.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby melinda » Fri 15 Feb, 2013 10:38 pm

Hi Kanangra and Alex,
I didn't find any official reports.
Just stories ..... (prefer not to repeat them because I don't know how factual the are.)
I took some photos at the time but have lost a lot of data from my computer recently.
Here a couple of screen shots from the article that I wrote about this trip for the SBW Magazine, November 2009. Sorry for the poor quality.

ScreenHunter_01 Feb. 15 23.24.jpg
ScreenHunter_01 Feb. 15 23.24.jpg (59.85 KiB) Viewed 30041 times


ScreenHunter_02 Feb. 15 23.24.jpg
ScreenHunter_02 Feb. 15 23.24.jpg (67.78 KiB) Viewed 30041 times


I have been told that as little as a couple of years ago, there was still luggage strewn about, but we didn't find any!
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Sun 17 Feb, 2013 1:40 pm

Melinda,

that is fascinating. I really had no idea. All the times i have walked that ridge and was oblivious to the wreckage. I really have to take a look at this. Years ago I found the remains of an old Mosquito bomber that came down during the 2nd World War up on Barrington Tops. (NB this is not the plane that was thought to have come down up there c1981 but has never been found. I've looked for it plenty of times but never found it). Thank you for posting the photos. Do I understand correctly that that was how things appeared even up until a few years ago?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby melinda » Sun 17 Feb, 2013 3:37 pm

Hi Kanangra,
These photos were taken in either Oct or Sept, 2009.
I too, had walked straight past this site many times and never seen the plane.
It isn't obvious from the track. You have to be looking over the side to see it.
I had been told to look for trees that were burnt on one side only (as the fire from the crashed plane burnt up on to the ridge) and pink tape!
Feel free to send me a private message for more info if required!
Krungles Bungles is such a nice walk! :D
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Mon 25 Feb, 2013 8:44 am

I've been looking into this. From the tail markings the plane was probably a Cessna. I haven't been able to find any official record of the crash or even a media report. From the article it sounds as if it went down in 1965. Or no later than 1966. Does anyone know the date of the trip in the article went out? Apparantly it was the same weekend as the Daniels sub 24hrs. 3 peaks record.

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Tue 26 Feb, 2013 12:03 am

Kanangra,

I had a look online as well and couldn't find anything on record from the tail markings. I found this to be quite odd as I would have though that incidents were recorded in some shape or form in that time period. Maybe the details are kept by another organisation previous to the one that currently provides the incident reports so they have not been published.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Tue 26 Feb, 2013 9:19 am

Alex yes it is most perplexing. Somebody must know something. Perhaps one of the historical societies up in the mountains? Apparantly official records only go back to 1969?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby juxtaposer » Fri 01 Mar, 2013 9:54 am

It was before the flooding of the Burragorang, about 1959. The pilot managed to find his way down the Cox and the first peole he met were men clearing the valley floor in preparation for the flooding.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby corker » Sat 02 Mar, 2013 8:52 pm

A member of our club found the plane wreck on Guouogang in 1973. A few days later he rang the Dept of Civil Aviation to report it and was told that the plane had been on a trip from Bankstown to Lake Cargelligo on 9th April 1968. The pilot had died in the crash.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 11:03 am

The strange thing about it is that the article says that the trip went out in 1966?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 11:12 am

I've just checked the SMH for 10th April 1968 and sure enough Corker is right!!! All the details are there.

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 11:39 am

Kanangra, would you be able to post a link to the SMH article. I can't seem to track it down!
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby melinda » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 5:34 pm

Wondering if there is more than one wrecked plane up there?
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 6:03 pm

There might well be if the information from the SMH is correct! I had doubts that the trip date of 1966 may have been incorrect, but the report refers to the Athol Abrahams and Dave Dash trip with occurred on the same weekend. Their trip report also states 1966 as the year in which it took place, so I will be quite interested if there is in fact a second plane up there in the bush!
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby melinda » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 7:13 pm

Thinking second plane is the one ainemrg refers to:
I, my husband and two children were camped at the junction of Christies and the Kowmung with a group from The Upper Blue Mountains Bushwalking Club. On Sunday morning, in low cloud, we saw a plane fly overhead and up Christies Creek.

https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/in ... /aair19930
(1993/7km SW Kanangra Walls)
Right area.
Thinking there must be an earlier wreck out there too!
Juxtaposer says:
It was before the flooding of the Burragorang, about 1959. The pilot managed to find his way down the Cox and the first peole he met were men clearing the valley floor in preparation for the flooding.
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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 8:07 am

I'm very sorry but I don't know how to post links. I found it in google. But here is the text of the article from page 1 of the SMH from 10th April, 1968:

"SOLO PILOT CRASHES IN MOUNTAINS"

A single engined Cessna aircraft crashed into a mountain in heavy cloud near Jenolan Caves yesterday. The fate of the pilot, Mr Murray Waddell married with two children of Collaroy, was not known last night. The Cessna careered into the mountain side 50 feet below the top of the ridge, burst into flames and set fire to a large area of surrounding forest. The plane was on a private flight from Bankstown to Canowindra via Oberon.

Police and DCA officers will leave Oberon at 5:00AM today for the crash scene which is in rugged country in the vicinity of the Coxs and Konangaroo Rivers about 8 miles south east of Oberon. Civil Aviation Search and Rescue officers at Mascot last night said Mr Waddell planned to fly from Bankstown to Canowindra on a visual flight plan. He left Bankstwon at 8:00AM. By 2:00PM when nothing had been heard from the missing plane DCA officers implemented a full search. Several aircraft from Bankstown were asked to join the search.

The wreckage of the Cessna was found yesterday afternoon by Mr Vic Walton a test pilot employed Rex Aviation Co. at Bathurst. Mr Walton said last night he was flight testing an aircraft near Warragamba Dam at 3:00PM when he saw a wisp of smoke through a break in the clouds about 30 miles up the Blue Mountains. He investigated and found the burnt out wreck."


The article then continued to describe the club the pilot flew with and his experience which was about 150 hours.

My sense is that the pilot who found the wreck simply flew over it and recorded its position as there would have been insufficient time for him to get in there and out again on foot.

Also note the historical reference to Kanangra Ck. as Konangaroo River. This is how it is marked on some old maps I have. Apparantly it was known as the Konangaroo to all the old timers of the Coxs.

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 10:43 am

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby kanangra » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 11:10 am

All the details seem to tie in with the crash in question near Guouogang. Now all we can't account for is the dates in the articles? Were they written at the time or years later as part of a recounting of old trips? Is the Daniels' 3 peaks trip recorded elsewhere independently?

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Re: Old Plane Crash Site on Mt Guouogang

Postby Allchin09 » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 11:45 am

I'm starting to believe that the photos Melinda posted were of the 1966 dated plane crash encounter. After comparing the posted images of the tail plane to that of those that Cessna produced in the years leading up to 1966, I can't find any that seem to match. The SMH article specifies that it was a Cessna aircraft, so I am inclined to think that the aircraft they they reported wan't the one described in the 1966 visit or in Melinda's photos.
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