Bushwalk Australia

Nice, I like that z-packs are now attaching a "solid" floor rather than a mesh floor.

That said, other than an old school swag that I used for most of my late teens when camping I've never used a single wall shelter.

How well do these sorts of tents compare to a double walled model (my 2 lightish tents are a power lizard and more recently a moment dw for reference)? Do they suffer from a lot of condensation? Are they colder due to not having a semi stationary pocket of air between the fly and the inner tent?

they need good ventilation to avoid condensation, the mountaineering ones can be chronic for condensation, they dont tend to have good ventilation... since a two wall tent has a more breathable inner to remove moisture single walled tents have the wall coated to reduce moisture getting in...

Bubbalouie wrote:How well do these sorts of tents compare to a double walled model (my 2 lightish tents are a power lizard and more recently a moment dw for reference)? Do they suffer from a lot of condensation? Are they colder due to not having a semi stationary pocket of air between the fly and the inner tent?

I'm not sure that single walls get any more condensation than a double. It's really that the inner wall acts as a 'bumper' to stop you coming into contact with the wet outer wall, at the expense of usable space. I think zpacks mid designs are intended to be pitched with a fair gap between the ground and the bottom of the wall, to encourage air exchange and prevent condensation - in a storm you would pitch lower to the ground to prevent driving rain, at the expense of more condensation.

I question how much warmer a mesh inner really is - I suspect you need to move to a 4 season tent with a less breathable inner to really get a warmer tent through a pocket of warmer air. 2 wall tents do however generally pitch closer to the ground, which means less warm air being carried away by the wind.

Single skin tents are not as warm as double skin tents - that can be good or bad. The condensation issue is more complicated. With the same fly design, the effect of the inner is to separate you from the condensation that will form on the fly - it doesn't particularly alter the amount of condensation, just that any drips fall onto the inner rather than the occupants. The inner material forms a break in the temperature gradient - warm in the inner, cool between the inner and fly, cold outside the tent. Depending on the conditions (relative humidity and dew point) condensation can form on either, or both, the inner and the fly. Generally the fly collects most of the condensation.

The important design component to minimise condensation is the venting of the fly. Can air flow through and preferably exit at the top. Your body heat is slightly warming the air so it is trying to rise. Your breathing, cooking etc is adding to the water vapour so a decent top vent is quite important, especially if the bottom of the fly is pinned close to the ground. If the fly is high enough off the ground (eg open tarps) then there is sufficient air flow to minimise condensation.

Another factor is of course the wind which is needed to drive the air through the tent - usually much more condensation on calm nights compared to windier conditions. Pitch where there is likely to be a breeze rather than a fully sheltered site.

Many thanks, so it's really more of a dry weather or summer tent if comfort is a significant factor.

They're an interesting tent, looks very light duty, but I suppose looks can be deceiving.
Have never heard of this material, but like the cuben stuff sacks they have too.

For 3 or 4 of us over many years, we have used a black diamond megamid . . . with pole, pegs, but without floor, it weighs 1.6kg, so for 3 of us that's spread weight of other gear = 530gms ea or 4 of us 400gms.
We've thought for years that was pretty good, and I suppose it was compared to the times we used to each take a tent of at least 2kg, through to several kg.

We've used that for the South Coast Track tassie, all the AAWT, Larapinta, and Pangpema (Kanchenjunga north base camp at 5200m / -17c, it did snow in the tent in the morning though !) and many remote northern walks here in SA.

I also have a Henry Squires tarp tent, which I've only used a few times, must used that more, it is ~ 700gms and quite fine for 1 and gear inside.
Have a bit of Gossamer gear I've bought over the years, but looks like there's a lot more to the ultra light gear I have lost touch with.

Walking_addict wrote:They're an interesting tent, looks very light duty, but I suppose looks can be deceiving.
Have never heard of this material, but like the cuben stuff sacks they have too.

The .51oz/sq yd cuben they use on the fly is half the weight and of comparable durability to the 30 denier or so Silnylon found on many tents, Tarptents included. The cuben actually has a far higher tensile strength and tear resistance but slightly lower abrasion resistance.

The 1.0 oz/sqyd stuff they use on the floor is very tough and strong, but again, being a laminate is more prone to abrasion damage than woven fabrics, but is again about half the weight of a 70D silnylon.

Cuben is magic stuff. Great tensile strength, light, no stretch, UV stable, inherently waterproof and ripstop. The perfect fly fabric.