Boots for kokoda-Where to begin?

[Whos_asking99]

Good Evening all.

As I have posted before, I am hopefully doing the Kokoda track next year, and have decided that now would be the time to get a pair of boots for the trek in order to wear them in well.

I however havent the foggiest of an idea of where to begin...gore-tex seems to be the way to go.
Price isnt as much of a concern as quality at the moment. One style that I was looking at is: http://www.snowgum.com.au/shop/product/ ... tex-unisex

My Uncle suggested army boots (something similar to these: http://kitbag.com.au/category973_1.htm) for extra ankle support, but I personally think that they would be a little bit to rough.

Any Ideas/suggestions/thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Aaron

[Son of a Beach]

My preferred boots would be Zamberlans, but you can no longer buy them in Australia (I think?). Apparently you can get them shipped here, but unless you're certain of your size, that sounds a bit risky to me.

My current boots are Raichle's and I'm very happy with them.

You really need to try the boots out and be very sure of them before your purchase. Don't just take my advice, or anyone else's, on what brand (or model) is good. Everyone's feet have different shapes and work differently. Some brands/models work better for some feet than others, so you've got to find out what works well for you. My previous boots were Scarpas. They were excellent boots, but they did not suit my feet (they were plenty long enough, but were a tad narrow, so were a bit uncomfortable for the 10 years I used them).

[wello]

Wild magazine had a boot survey a couple of issues ago. It covered among other things the choice between goretex and traditional full grain leather. Sorry I can't find the issue, but I'm pretty sure it was during 2008.

I read Peter Fitzsimmon's book on Kokoda, and I expect you're in for a lot of steep climbs, a heap of mud, slippery river crossings and tree roots making everything a bit more difficult. Good thing you're not getting shot at! With all that in mind, I'd suggest a full grain leather boot. There is a bit of personal preference in the choice, but take your time finding a good fit, and for my money the leather boot is more reliable and can be very comfortable too. I had a pair of Merrells recently that were excellent, plus a number of others over the years. Scarpa are superbly made, and if they suit your foot shape they would be a good choice.

I recently tried a Goretex boot made by Salomon. They are very comfortable, but surprisingly not overly waterproof (mind you, no boot is waterproof when the water level is above the top of the boot!). More disturbingly, the stiching started to fray after only ten days in the bush. These days did include some off track scrub work, and plenty of climbing on Tassie dolerite scree, but nothing particularly extreme. The shop I bought them from replaced them without issue, but unfortunately the replacement pair also blew out their stitching, after only 3 days this time. They just don't seem to hang together when they're wet. As a general rule, the synthetic boots tend to have more pieces stitched together, which makes them look good, but does give more failure points. I reckon you need as few failure points as possible in a testing place like kokoda.

So for my money, I'd buy leather. Take some time and wear them in, before you go though.

Have a top trip

Wello

[Whos_asking99]

Thanks for all the advice.

I got a trip into Hobart today and had a fair look, very informative, came to these conclusions.

Design wise leather boots seem the way to go as their is less to no stitching to be "broken" by sticks, rocks etc.
But they are heavier than synthetic/goretex boots and are likely to become even worse once their waterlogged, so what this will be like on day 3rd day of any walk I have no idea.

Scarpa are superbly made, and if they suit your foot shape they would be a good choice.

This Scarpa boot (LINK) which I tried today fit me surprisingly well, so at the moment its my pick.

The Goretex boots that I tried were THIS and THIS

At the moment completely undecided...each have Pros and Cons.

[Son of a Beach]

You're right that each have their pros and cons, and trying to figure out what's right for you can be difficult. Full leather boots certainly are heavier, but so long as their not excessively heavy (which I've never found them to be), it's really not much of a problem.

Remember that you can't add the weight of boots to your overall load. While walking, you'll generally have one foot on the ground and one foot in the air (or both feet on the ground). While your foot is on the ground, with your weight on it, your boot weighs effectively nothing (it's carrying your weight, you're not carrying its weight). While your foot is in the air, it is carrying ONLY the weight of the boot, not any of the weight in your pack (which is being carried by the other foot - on the ground - unless you're jumping across a creek, and both feet are in the air!).

So yes, the weight of boots is certainly a factor, but I've never found it to be a problem - water logged, or not. I'm on my 3rd pair of full leather boots, and so far, each of them has lasted more than 10 years of fairly solid bushwalking use. For the 2 old pairs that eventually died, the first thing to go in both cases was the stitching. This definitely seems to be the weak point in most boots/shoes, so for serious repeated use over many years, the less pieces the better. A single piece of leather with less stitching is going to be a little more water proof for a little longer too (but remember that NO boots/shoes are completely water proof, no mater what the salesman says).

[woka]

I'm onto my second pair of AKU's (goretex) and have been very happy with both pairs. The sole eventually dropped off my first pair (in the middle of the bush in the NT!) when the tread was almost worn off, but the stitching was completely intact.

But leather is pretty hard to beat when the going gets really tough. I agree with Nik about the weight. When I worked for Forestry in WA, we used to wear leather boots with steel caps in the bush. They feel heavy if you haven't worn them for a while, but you very quickly adjust and, before you know it, you don't even notice the weight.

[tas-man]

There are a lot of resources on the web with information about walking the Kokoda Track, which you are no doubt going through

I lived in PNG for 2 years (1978/79) and did a lot of bushwalking there, with a good number of week long extended walks, but did not walk Kokoda, as I became aware that for the effort expended, there were far more scenic and interesting areas to visit first. Of course the history of the Kokoda track is a genuine reason for tackling it anyway.

If you are going to fly from Tassie to start walking the track without a few weeks aclimatisation, you WILL be sweating a LOT, so Gortex in your boots is just going to keep the moisture inside your boots if they are constantly wet and muddy and can't breathe! The important point is to choose footwear that will protect your feet and fit comfortably with your chosen socks without any pressure spots. Any skin damage or blisters will quickly become tropical ulcers which will require ongoing medical attention during the trek - not a nice way to climb up and down mountains! Even back then, in PNG walking clubs, there were strong feelings about appropriate footware. (See variety in photo below) The popular choice were ex-army commando style canvas boots that were relatively light and dried quickly after wading creeks. I wore a pair of full leather high style Canadian boots that I used to soak with neatsfoot oil between trips. The oil worked its way through my wool miners socks and into my skin, effectively waterproofing my feet! After a week of wet walking, my feet never went soft and wrinkly with this treatment . . . and no blisters! . . but they did smell oily for a while after each trip.

Me (centre-wearing black felt hat) with mates from Port Moresby Bushwalking Club at Garaina, ready to start a weeks trek over the Owen Stanley Range to Tapini.

[tas-man]

<SNIP> I wore a pair of full leather high style Canadian boots that I used to soak with neatsfoot oil between trips. The oil worked its way through my wool miners socks and into my skin, effectively waterproofing my feet! After a week of wet walking, my feet never went soft and wrinkly with this treatment . . . and no blisters! . . but they did smell oily for a while after each trip.

I couldn't find it at the time of my previous post, but recalled reading something about "lubricating feet" in Goulds 1877 book "How to Camp Out", posted in another thread. Here's what he said back then (P54).

To prevent foot-soreness, which is really the greatest bodily trouble you will have to contend with, you must have good shoes as already advised. You must wash your feet at least once a day, and oftener if they feel the need of it. The great preventive of foot-soreness is to have the feet, toes, and ankles covered with oil, or, better still, salve or mutton-tallow; these seem to act as lubricators. Soap is better than nothing. You ask if these do not soil the stockings. Most certainly they do. Hence wash your stockings often, or the insides of the shoes will become foul. Whenever you discover the slightest tendency of the feet to grow sore or to heat, put on oil, salve, or soap, immediately.

People differ as to these things. To some a salve acts as an irritant: to others soap acts in the same way. You must know before starting—your mother can tell you if you don't know yourself—how oil, glycerine, salve, and soap will affect your skin. Remember, the main thing is to keep the feet clean and lubricated. Wet feet chafe and blister more quickly than dry.

[I Am The Ant]

A friend of mine recently completed the Kokoda trek - his first ever trek anywhere, actually - and he used Taipan boots. He has a lot of trouble with his feet, and just about everything he puts on his feet causes him to end up in painful cramps and blisters, but he never had any issues with his Taipan boots.

I think they retail for between $180-200. They're a fair bit cheaper than a lot of the trekking boots I've seen. I can't vouch for them personally, but according to my friend, a lot of the guys on Kokoda had the u-beaut $500/pair boots and complained the whole time, whereas his didn't bother him.

I hope that helps.

Ant..


EDIT: I think the boot survey was in the Oct-Dec 2008 issue of Wild.

[Whos_asking99]

I lived in PNG for 2 years (1978/79) and did a lot of bushwalking there, with a good number of week long extended walks, but did not walk Kokoda/quote]

You may not have walked Kokoda...but 2 Years in PNG, wow...think I might refer to you for help later on

Oh yes, there is several books worth of info around...slowly wading my way through it (attempted joke about mud...fails miserably). But it seems that the more expensive your gear, the easier it would be, even more so with boots.

The popular choice were ex-army commando style canvas boots that were relatively light and dried quickly after wading creeks

As I stated before, I was looking at these, but my initial thoughts that would be really rigid and solid with not a great deal of give...but then i'm no expert. So im leaning towards the Scarpas as I havent heard anyone complaning

Any skin damage or blisters will quickly become tropical ulcers which will require ongoing medical attention during the trek

Thats what has me worried at the moment, there have apprently been cases where people have had to be air-lifted out because they just havent been able to go anymore.

Thanks for bringing the foot oil to my attention, yet another thing to look into.

Oh, and can you please repost that photo...I'm curious as to the types of boots worn, thanks.

PS: This post seems to have gone hay-wire with the lay-out with quotes, and i'm lost as to how to fix it
Just read from the top, its should all be clear.

[Whos_asking99]

A friend of mine recently completed the Kokoda trek - his first ever trek anywhere, actually - and he used Taipan boots. He has a lot of trouble with his feet, and just about everything he puts on his feet causes him to end up in painful cramps and blisters, but he never had any issues with his Taipan boots.

Hmm Taipan boots, never heard of them but they dont look to bad...am willing to look at all suggestions, I have the time, not going till next year

And will also look for that issue of Wild, thanks.

[Nuts]

Gee Tasman, I thought there was nothing daggyer than a bunch of bushwalkers.... Now I realise how far things have come since the 70's

WA- Good quality Leather (especially the Zamberlains mentioned) boots are reliable. I would ask around some of the many 'trekking' companies (google search) there to see what the guides recommend.. perhaps a fabric boot would be better?

[jules21]

i walked the kokoda in 2003 with a non-waterproof pair of cheap Hy-Tecs. no problems to report. the track is very soft, with many tree roots, for the most part. the porters do it in old sneakers, which makes you feel silly.

i've just bought myself a pair of waterproof, synthetic Dachsteins for an upcoming trek to Nepal. should come in handy for Tassie at some stage.

[prankphonecall]

Well my 15yr old LaSportiva faithfull finally gave it up the other month, so i went out and bought some Asolo Voyager XCR http://www.asolo.com/content.asp?L=3&idMen=420.

They were pretty comfortable straight up (have been wearing them in, but been behaving themselves so far), but alot more rigid than the others i tried (scarpa and other LaSportiva). By rigid i mean that you can't twist the toe and heal in opposite directions where as some of the other brands you could almost get 180 degrees and just felt a lot more solid underfoot (possibly not as comfortable though).

They are light weight, gortex and appear well constructed too. The soles are also designed to disperse mud better than other boots (but i think most modern boots are the same now). I imagine thats why the locals use old sand shoes, so they don't hold the mud.

They guy at the shop kept raving on about them being the shoe of choice for Kokoda, with many great reviews. He also had the previous model through the canadian and colorado high country along with some outback stuff in Aus.

Will give them their first real run through in Tassie over the next few weeks, so lets how they're as good as this guys reckons. But sure look like they could handle the rigors of the Kokoda.

[Whos_asking99]

Me (centre) with mates from Port Moresby Bushwalking Club at Garaina, ready to start a weeks trek over the Owen Stanley Range to Tapini.

Good picture Tasman, certainly puts things into perspective.

hmmm, not a bad boot there prankphonecall....which store did you get them from?

Thanks.

[prankphonecall]

K2 basecamp or K2 odessey - I leave for tassie on the weekend, will let you know how they fared...

[galaxxian]

Just come across this thread while roaming the net, thought I'd pop in to second the suggestion of Taipans as I have a couple pairs (4071's and 4075's) and love them.

Taipan do military, fire and emergency services boots, are a very popular alternative to the Australian Army terra boot (especially with the SAS, heard around that some of the US special forces guys are sourcing them after seeing our guys rave about them so much). Often referred to as "combat air nikes", they're light, very durable (as to be expected with an Aussie made boot), have high quality leather and rarely need breaking in. The soles are a sandwich of two rubber densities, so they have a decently grippy firm tread with a squishy shock absorbing middle, the sole is moulded in once process so the tread wont delaminate like sports shoes do.

The website kinda sucks as it's flash based and the pics are small.
http://www.taipanfootwear.com/

For tropics I'd probably look at the 4074 vented miltary and 4075 combat boots, both are well vented and the black leather will tolerate water exposure better than the nubuck leather that the army guys wear. The venting on the 4074's is higher up, so they'll tolerate shallow puddle splashing a bit better, but they're also a little bit warmer.

if you're hesitant I'd suggest trying a pair on, I knew from the second the first pair went on my feet that I was going to buy them, comfort wise they're second to none.

[Whos_asking99]

K2 basecamp or K2 odessey - I leave for tassie on the weekend, will let you know how they fared...

Thanks for that prankphonecall.

And thanks for that post galaxxian...sounds like they would definatley be worth trying...does anyone know of a store in Southern Tasmania that stocks them? Because ive never seen them around here before.

[I Am The Ant]

And thanks for that post galaxxian...sounds like they would definatley be worth trying...does anyone know of a store in Southern Tasmania that stocks them? Because ive never seen them around here before.

Amare Safety
17 Pearl Street,
Derwent Park. Tasmania. 7009
PH 03 62730 133
Email: [email protected]


Oh, and I asked my friend the other day which style he actually purchased for Kokoda... it was the 4079's - Military Pantone/Kangaroo.

Ant..


EDIT: Also, if you're unable to get them in Tas, you can purchase them direct from Taipan in Vic over the phone and have them sent directly to you. My friend got two pairs sent to him that way, and they came within 3 days of ordering.

[Jacob]

G'day,

I have trekked the Kokoda Track twice and in the same boots.
I did most of my training for the trek in my boots and loved every moment of it.
I have the Hi Tec Altitude and would recommend them 100%
I have a friend who had a pair of Scarpa, but for at least 2 months he was hating the experience while his boots moulded to His feet. After they did, he too trekked the Kokoda Track once with me. By the time I was up for my second trek, he needed to either get new boots or get the tread replaced.

I now run INVESTA TREKS and take trekkers on Guided Kokoda Treks. We are all about investing in others so check us out.
http://www.salvos.org.au/INVESTATREKS
With our experienced Guide, and porters we aim to offer everyone a rewarding experience for a great price.
We offer 10 day professional Kokoda packages.
See how you go, but I will be getting another pair probably after the next trek, but recommend the Hi Tec for sure.
All the best.

[ozjolly]

G'day Aaron and all,

I did Kokoda last year. Of course I also struggled with choosing a boot. As others have said, fit is far more important than brand. Personally I bought some full leather boots with some gore-tex clone (can't remember name) lining and didn't get wet feet at all, which is 9/10ths of the battle with preventing blisters. I also used two socks (coolmax liner and thorlo syntetic outer) and didn't get a blister on the whole walk!

It's not water that you need to worry about in keeping your feet dry, it's sweat! And one thing that will guarantee wet feet is long (i.e. just under knee) gaiters. The lower half of your leg will sweat and drench your socks as it drips down. So go ankle height gaitors. You'll get a bit of mud on your lower legs, but if that's going to bother you then kokoda's not for you

I also noted that the Kokoda half (from Mt Bellamy north) is a lot rockier than the Owers Corner section. We walked Owers to Kokoda and the under-sole strap on my gaiters wore through on the last day. So make sure they are leather/wire.

And finally, enjoy it. It'll be one hell of an adventure. And make sure to savour Isurava, it's one of the most incredible places you'll ever experience.

Joel

[Son of a Beach]

I now run INVESTA TREKS and take trekkers on Guided Kokoda Treks. We are all about investing in others so check us out.
http://www.salvos.org.au/INVESTATREKS
With our experienced Guide, and porters we aim to offer everyone a rewarding experience for a great price.
We offer 10 day professional Kokoda packages.

Thanks for posting some great information. However, the above paragraph looks a lot like marketing, which is forbidden on these forums without permission. Being that it appears to be part of the Salvos, I'll assume it's non-profit, and will leave it as is for now (as it's actually good information too). However, please keep the forum rules in mind regarding advertising in future.