climberman wrote:frustrating, but silly of parks to ignore the fact that emotions do count for things in managing community assets.
stry wrote:Maddog, thank for those population increase figures away back. I'm not in a position to query the methodology by which the numbers were arrived at, because I don't know what that methodology was.
If we accept that rates of increase are as modest as stated, the population would be barely hanging on, requiring only a change of circumstances for the growth to cease, or slide into decline.
If this is in fact the case (and I'm not suggesting that it isn't, or contradicting what you have supplied ), surely control/reduction would be very simple once the pollies grasped the nettle of uninformed public opinion.
Certainly those numbers do not imply a doubling of numbers every few years.
mikethepike wrote:climberman wrote:frustrating, but silly of parks to ignore the fact that emotions do count for things in managing community assets.
Thanks climberman and that is why I calculated the $6 million figure which is not an unreasanable operating cost IMO although I wonder if the Gov't is seeking mandate to take on a more aggressive 'culling' program. I am very sympathetic to the heritage view but back to the horses, am I right in assuming that the horses causing the most concern are at large primaily in the snow gum (only eucalyptus species) country? While the snow gum country is exceedingly beautiful, I think that in terms of unique plant spp and plant associations at risk, then it is the alpine vegetation (above the tree line) that is the most special. Do horses still wonder into these areas can anyone tell me? If so, then this surely ought to be the first priority to be addressed once the review is completed.
The Snowy Mountain Riders consider that objections to them riding in the Park are maybe driven by other peoples' jealosy. I can't think of a more beautiful place to ride in Australia than though the open areas of the snow gum country and do wonder whether there is not room even for commercial horse trekking in parts of the ranges. Maybe the whole of the high country should be re-evaulated to see how different uses can all be better accomodated and managed. The top priority though is surely to fully protect identified high quality tracts of vegetation from further damage by reducing horse numbers and then having a plan to not let the population recover.
climberman wrote:Impact can be seen above the treelike above dead horse gap.
Lots of impacts to bogs, swamps and creeks.
Allchin09 wrote:An article on feral horses in the Snowies. It's disturbing to see that the "cannibal horse" story that had been mentioned in conversation over on the NPWS site might actually be true!
http://theconversation.com/the-grim-sto ... rses-31691
maddog wrote:Amazing. A population of herbivores suddenly turns to cannibalism once it is realised their numbers are growing far more slowly than originally speculated. On a serious note, it sounds like it’s only a matter of time and brumbies will start eating bushwalkers.
A horse dies with relatively full bowels. It's halfway through winter and it doesn't have huge amount of fat reserves left and has started breaking down muscle. It's cold and the body does not decompose.
A carnivorous scavenger arrives and tears open the abdominal cavity and eats several of the more nourishing organs (perhaps liver,spleen, or heart). In doing so it tears open the stomach or small intestine.
Other horses walk past, now hungrier than they have ever been before, as feral horse numbers have never been higher.
They can smell the feed left in the bowels even though the beginnings of decomposition have left other unpleasant smells.
One or two sniff the dead horse.
Over a week, more and more horses follow the trail, adding their smells to the environment.
Finally, a couple horses, reassured by the decidedly horsey smells accumulated over the past few weeks nibble at the exposed semi-digested herbage.
Two then walk by and document 'Cannibalism
maddog wrote:Allchin09 wrote:An article on feral horses in the Snowies. It's disturbing to see that the "cannibal horse" story that had been mentioned in conversation over on the NPWS site might actually be true!
http://theconversation.com/the-grim-sto ... rses-31691
Amazing. A population of herbivores suddenly turns to cannibalism once it is realised their numbers are growing far more slowly than originally speculated. On a serious note, it sounds like it’s only a matter of time and brumbies will start eating bushwalkers.
Nuts wrote:
Cannibalism is an Ed herring
.Nuts wrote:Thought i'd give myself a laugh, just in case there were no ol timers (or 5yo'lds) around... we really should just stick to a display of outrage, that'll change the world
geoskid wrote:.Nuts wrote:Thought i'd give myself a laugh, just in case there were no ol timers (or 5yo'lds) around... we really should just stick to a display of outrage, that'll change the world
Amen. We could use the hiatus to talk about the importance of an accurate description of the world, before attempting devising a course of action - that could be novel.
maddog wrote:Local journalist Andrew Page discusses the claim of cannibal brumbies in the KNP. The clip includes features a highly critical Peter Cochran of the Snowy Mountains Bush Users Group, the sceptical local vet Mike Mesley, and one of the academics, Don Driscoll, defending his claims.
icefest wrote:This would be easier with a transcript.
I'm not sure how this video makes any new points.
Andrew Page (with his "expert" opinion) states that to be a cannibal you need to kill the thing you are eating (and that this must be for survival). This is clearly wrong.
Peter Chochran doesn't really add to the discussion at hand. All he says is that one even of horse cannibalism would not make all horses cannibals.
His logic: humans have been cannibals in the past but that one event does not make all humans cannibals. As horses will not eat meat unless starved they can't all be called cannibals.
Mike Mesley (a local vet):
States that the is no past evidence of horses eating meat (but that if it happened then they would've been eating the grass in the intestines of the dead horses).
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