Buying online / Cost of gear in Australia

[brissifirey]

I think this is the right fourm, if not sorry , After a new tent and 70+ L backpack, I think I have found the pack(but any advice would be great) but the tent mm I dont know, MSR hubber or WE Dart seem to suit my needs, plenty of reviews on the MSR hubber but not to many on WE dart, has any one got/used either the hubber or the WE dart?, also in regards to price , in Aussi the hubber is around $500, but in USA its just over $230 even with shipping its still under $300, so my question is has anyone had any problems buying online from a USA store?

Cheers.

[Son of a Beach]

Sorry, I don't have any experience with any of the tents you mentioned. There's a couple of topics here on tents and packs already, but I can't recall seeing any discussion of those particular tent models.

However, although I've not bought tents online before, I have bought several other items online from the USA and I discovered that you do need to be aware of the possibility of having to pay import duty/tax for costly items you buy online from overseas. I once had a package get caught up in customs due it's being over the value threshold for imported goods duty/tax. I merely had to pay some import duty, and it was released to me. I can't remember what the threshold of goods' value is for this, nor what the rate of taxation was, but just be aware that it can happen occasionally if buying something expensive.

In my case the item I bought (I think it was valued at around $250, several years ago) was still cheaper than buying it in Australia even after the import duty, but not by anywhere near as much as I first had counted on.

[Joe]

never bought camping gear, but have bought plenty of other stuff. DVD's aplenty, never any dramas. Also bought quite a few camera lenses (~$400us) from US shipped with UPS sweet as.

[Joe]

My understanding of import duty...and I only know this second hand from another forum...is that if the item is under $1000 you are safe.

Tasadam might be able to help...i belive he just spent over that on camera from HK...

[Son of a Beach]

Yes, I've since bought items more expensive than the one I was taxed on without any problems. It was only the once, and I've no idea why they picked it out. It maybe some random inspection thing?

[corvus]

Do not have experince buying a tent and as I am in the market will appreciate any feedback but have bought lots of other B/W gear from USA and have not had any problems.

[tasadam]

Thinking about it, I haave bought quite a bit from overseas. No camping gear though.
Only one item I have bought from USA that was over $200 - that was a new camera lens that was over $2K. Customs wanted some money - typically GST, The customs web site has more info on that.
One small video camera I bought for a friend from USA cost AU$160. I asked them whether they would consider indicating a lesser price on the doco and when it got here the paperwork said "Toy camera, $40". Had to laugh.
From Hong Kong I have bought a bit of camrea gear. I use an ebay store that don't mind fiddling the numbers to get it thru customs. A $1500 package came with an indicated value of $580, and I didn't ask them to do that.
Usually when I buy from overseas I pay with Paypal. Not that it's fool-proof, but seems safer than giving my cc number to somene on the other side of the world where I can't chase them down.
Most of my purchases have been with ebay or amazon - reputable businesses.

In this day and age, I would personally not be too concerned at dealing with internet companies from overseas - send them an email asking something - even if it's to confirm freight charge, and see if the response makes them sound fair dinkum. Best you can do.

The world is a smaller place now that we have fast internet. Good luck.

[Joe]

Most of my purchases have been with ebay..... - reputable businesses.

HAHAHA...*choke*....what?

[tasadam]

Most of my purchases have been with ebay..... - reputable businesses.

HAHAHA...*choke*....what?

Fair call. It was the wee hours of this morning.
What I mean was the companies I do business with on eBay for expensive items are the likes of HKsupplies, silviosphotoworks. Online sellers with good feedback and that have been around for a long time (hence my definition of reputable). Doesn't guarantee anything, just improves your odds.
And Amazon of course.
Less expensive items, you take at face value when dealing on eBay - "Is it worth the risk - for the amount I can save instead of buying locally?"

[Penguin]

I bought my tent online - it was not available in Australia. Had no trouble buying from an equivalent store frot in the USA similar to Paddy Pallin etc. It was around $400 with no import duty was added.

The only question I raise is that if we bought all our gear online wold the local camping sotre survive and does that matter?

I tend to look at price online and if teh local price is not too much more I will buy locally becuase I want the shop there for all rhose little items I would like and for service. Yes online can be cheaper becuase of lowerl overheads, but are we happy to loose the local store and the services it provides??

[corvus]

Good post ,I also purchase my bigger gear locally but some hi-tech stuff is just so much cheaper on line i.e. GPS and my weakness stoves and titanium stuff so to have the extra to spend at home I save by overseas purchases

[Joe]

I tend to be the opposite. anything under $100 ill buy locally every time if its available. Bigger stuff where the margin between buying online and locally can equal up to a ton in the pocket I tend to buy online. A lot of my purchases for hobbies tend to be bought with money made doing work outside work (eg photography, webdesign etc) and accordingly I will budget the cost to customer of the job to suit what i want to buy...if this is the case i tend to buy locally as well

[tasadam]

I can't think of any bushwalking gear that I have bought online.
Camera gear, that's a different story.

[DonQx]

Have bought quite a few items on-line from USA the last 12 months. Mostly motorbike & camping gear. No problems at all so far.

Usually $ savings of 30-45% compared to local prices, often also faster service. The best one was a fuel tank for my bike, quoted ~$550 in Oz with 2 weeks delivery time, ordered one for Oz$300 including postage from USA, arrived on the door step 5 working days after ordering.

Bought the MSR Hubba Hubba for our Xmas South Coast Track trip online in Dec 07 from moontrail.com. Can't remember exactly, but think it ended up costing a bit less than Oz$300 all up, delivery within 9 days or so. Good price, good service. I'm assuming that most larger on-line dealers have got the act together to a very high customer service standard, so this is not a plug for moontrail in particular, more for reputable on-line dealers in general, wherever they may be ... which reminds me ... recently bought a GPS accessory from an Oz online dealer who used a USA site to handle the payment ... the Oz$ price that I agreed to got converted to US$ at the payment point and that saved another 15% ... didn't feel like complaining at all ...

Have paid customs tax only once a few years ago on a Oz$750 Hilleberg tent, that was just before customs raised the tax-free threshold to $1000 .

Comment on MSR Hubba Hubba ... excellent tent if it is used in the right conditions ... good on the South Coast Track (a few pics in the slideshow at http://ahack.org). Very light for internal volume, spacious enuf for Susanne & me with each having a our own vestibule on the long side of the tent. I presume that the Dart would be stronger due to pole setup. Limitations of Hubba Hubba: all mesh inner tent is great for ventilation but may be too cold in cold & windy conditions?, and I'd avoid exposed camp sites in windy conditions due to the pole configuration.

Our 4 seasons tent for both of us is a Salewa Sierra Leone, 1.5kg heavier but also more spacious.

a.

[frank_in_oz]

We have bought several items from the one place. Started as an eBay purchase but they have their own online store. NEVER had any dramas and several of my mates have bought from the same place. Can PM anyone if you want to know the name.
Usually focus on expensive stuff - MSR titanium pots, Thermarest mats, Whisperlite burner.
Never any dramas with taxes, usually arrive in 5-7 days and they usually include international freight in the price....

[Son of a Beach]

Can PM anyone if you want to know the name.

Feel free to post it here, if you like. If you're a regular contributor here, and you have no association with the business other than as a customer, there's no problem with adding informative posts about shops, etc, particularly in direct response to posted questions. So long as it doesn't look too much like advertising.

It's a fine line, but we'll aim to allow informative posts about businesses, but not advertising posts. Apologies in advance if we misjudge it, because it's sometimes hard to tell the difference.

[frank_in_oz]

No dramas, just wanted to be cautious - this one is blocked where I work because "weapons" are available on the site (God Bless America!) but I am pretty sure this is correct: http://www.mickiesplace.com
This is the ebay link to his online store:
http://stores.ebay.com/Mickies-Place-Outdoor-Gear

[corvus]

I can confirm that mickies place outdoor gear are good to deal with bought a MSR titan kettle from them in 2006 for a very good price and fast delivery

[walkinTas]

I can't think of any bushwalking gear that I have bought online.
Camera gear, that's a different story.

Close to 50% of my bw gear was purchased online, including my tent, tyvek gs, sleeping bag, mat, some clothing and many small items. I have even bought some gear on ebay. I have rules with online trading - like "always use paypal when available".

You should always carefully compare prices too. You have to add freight to most online purchases. Most don't include a local warranty, so if something goes wrong you usually have to ship it back at your expense (so may end up paying freight twice or three times).

I tend to look for a local dealer for anything expensive and bulky that might require servicing, simply because of shipping costs. Heavy and/or bulky items can cost a lot to freight, and things that might need servicing need to be handled close to home.

Other things to think about If it looks dodgy - it probably is! If it looks to good to be true - it definitely is! Look to see if the site (seller) has given contact details, especially a phone number. Try contacting the seller. If all you get is an answering machine or no reply, shop somewhere else. Consider paying a little extra for freight that is registered and can be tracked online.

I have only had two bad experiences, and both of them came out of the US. Some Americans, it would seem, have no idea where Tasmania is.

[frank_in_oz]

Thought this may amuse some of you:

Just finalised a protracted and complicated problem with an eBay purchase my son made (with my knowledge)
They shipped the wrong item (a one piece of the same thing , rather than a pants and jacket) I have been hassling for weeks to try and organise the correct item BUT the deal was we either payed for the wrong item to be sent back to the US @ about $25 OR paid for the pants to be shipped @ $40 PLUS postage....

Was not very happy and the guy could barely string 3 words together in his emails - for example:

WHat is this issue do you need a build it I got tangled in a long move but I would like to help you freight onthe build kit is $20 the kit is $50

sell the build a kit coes with netting and jute, if this could work i could give you adiscount teh trench ghillie and the ghillie jacket and pants are the same cost

I finally thought, stuff it, and lodged a Paypal dispute (worth remembering that if your pay with PayPal there is some protection....)

Things moved along a bit more quickly and we got $US25 refunded by him into our Pay pal account.

My final email to him was in reply to his question of "Was $25 OK?":
Yes,
That sounds fair.
Sorry to have stuffed you around
Frank

His reply, which I have to say made me laugh was :
No need to be sorry it is your right as a consumer dont forget it. I like the blog. I was an infantryman before i had this gig so i am familair with walking alot. ill keep it in my favorites - turns out he was just an ex-grunt trying to make a living, just had a bit of trouble clearly communicating by email......

[slick41st]

Have personlly bought about half of my gear overseas - always cheaper, and usually 6-12 months before you can get it here. Only been hit with duty when it has exceeded $500, but learnt after that to sent it to my mate in the Army, and customs seem to be more lenient on whether they charge duty or not.

A lot of shops online will not deal with overseas clients due to bad experiences, but I have a few who I have traded with for a while now and are quite good. My favourite is: http://www.backcountrygear.com/index.cfm easy to deal with and carry a reasonable range.

[brissifirey]

Well my gear, tent, sleeping bag, and water filter arrived from basegear in the US, very quick ,4 days, well packed and about 50% cheaper than getting it here, saying that any small stuff I will still support Aussi shops.

[Damien]

Basegear currently have a '20% off everything' promotion for signing up to their mailing list.
I put a rather large order through on Saturday and the prices were quite reasonable, as was the shipping cost.

[scockburn]

Hi brissy. If you are looking for a tent, there is a reasonable one that goes on "flea bay"from Black Wolf that is light and quite inexpensive. There is also another called DMH Outdoors from another online store, again quite inexpensive and reasonably light. Bothy have 1 and 2 person models. I was surprised that they have been mentioned positively in some reviews in the mags like Wild and the great annual mag called Adventure Gear Guide 2008.
Have you been up to K2 Odessy upstairs to have a look at their range. They currently have a really good special on a Macpac Marenet . Have a look at the Exped Vela ( love this one so far). I bought one there recently at a good price and when I compared the difference online etc , it was not really a huge difference and I think if you can support the local outlets it is worth it especially if they give a bit of a discount.They have several tents set up and give some great advise .I reckon if you ask , they'll give a discount . They give a 15% discount for Brisbane Bushwalker's Club Members. Good luck buying.Steve C

[under10kg]

I have purchased 90% of my gear online. This is because very light gear is not generally available here. If a supplier has a policy of not shipping overseas there is a guy on ebay that can forward the goods at $10 or so. I have had no problems purchasing overseas.

[Ent]

Content removed by poster

[Nuts]

Brett, comes up now and then (so I thought i'd help our mod's )


"Hi Nuts

As a professional accountant I am always a bit wary of definitive statements but as suggested did Google and found this link http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page.cfm?u=5549 that supports the statement on $1,000 is ok as per the below extract from that link

All goods (except for tobacco products and alcoholic beverages) may be imported duty and tax free if their value is $1,000 or less.
Note: However, where there are multiple packages to the same addressee in Australia from a single consignor overseas that arrive at about the same time, then the value of all packages will be combined for duty and tax assessment purposes"

Now I Must go and do some work....

[tasadam]

All goods (except for tobacco products and alcoholic beverages) may be imported duty and tax free if their value is $1,000 or less.
Note: However, where there are multiple packages to the same addressee in Australia from a single consignor overseas that arrive at about the same time, then the value of all packages will be combined for duty and tax assessment purposes

I bought a A friend of a friend bought a new camera and lens recently, both from Hong Kong. The lens arrived about a week earlier. $1725 versus the Aus price of $2595. So I'm told.
The camera body, Aus price $4295 (I just checked again and the local price has gone down - now $3950), cost me this person $2900, so I heard...
Of course this person was prepared to pay customs and duty - would still have been many hundreds cheaper than Aus price, but when the receipt and shipping declaration state figures under $1000, what am I to could this person do?
They made it through customs without delay.

Makes one wonder, though... Same item, made in same place, costing so much more here.
If the price was competitive there are other benefits of shopping locally. The "feel good" help the Australian economy thing, warranty without having to send overseas, etc.
But with SUCH a saving, what would you do?

[tasadam]

So I needed a new tripod.
Shopping - trying to find the one that does what I want it to do.
That was the hard bit. Finally decided on a Gitzo GT2542L.
Then I wanted to buy. Well, buying online was my only option, as there are no Gitzo dealers in Tasmania. Nowhere in Tasmania can you go into a store and see one.
Initially I went to the Australian sites, and the best deal I could find was here. AU$1149 plus $20 delivery.
I searched a camera forum and found a link to a Hong Kong site that had pretty good prices, and paid my AU$815 including freight. But then they tell you they do not have stock, so offered a refund, which I accepted.
More internet searching found the most popular place to buy from USA, this place. I would have liked to buy one and have it on its way, but they were closed last Monday for some Jewish holy day. Their price including delivery worked out at about AU$920.

More internet searching, and I found that the Aussie dollar was pretty good against the UK pound. Problem with that is freight - usually ridiculously expensive and very slow.
I thought I would try anyhow, so I had all my browser windows open for 6PM Monday just gone, when it was opening time over there.
I phoned the store I was looking at and they had stock. But they refused to express post / use a fast courier. And the postage they use costs upwards of AU$120.
Then I googled to see who the distributors of Gitzo were in the UK (as I did with Hong Kong but none of them have stock). I found the list. Tried phoning a few of them, hit brick walls as they wouldn't send overseas. Then I got onto a lady at a store who was very helpful, they use UPS freight, and they had stock.
The sums... UK 460 pound, but hang on, I'm overseas, so I don't have to pay VAT. UK 414 pound, plus 40 pound express delivery with UPS.
With the credit card overseas transaction fee (yet another fee that credit cards like to charge), my total cost was $856.
And when it hits Australia there's no duty or tax because it's under AU$1000.
They despatched it promptly, and as of this morning it was cleared from Customs in Melbourne, having gone to Stansted in the UK, Cologne in Germany, Dubai, Bangkok, Singapore. So today I phoned UPS in Australia asking how they ship things to Tassie, they were going to send it to Mini Messenger in Hobart, who would send it to Beaut Ute couriers in Launceston, who would transfer it to Beaut Ute in Ulverstone, who would deliver it to me, theoretically on Monday.
Instead I had it stopped in Melbourne, collected by a work colleague and sent via overnight freight, I will be collecting it tomorrow morning on its way to the first of what will hopefully be many overnight walks in Tasmania.

I feel for Australian retail stores, when they have to pay freight to get it, and duty and tax on an item that I can buy for less overseas, then without duty and without tax.
Over $300 better off in my pocket than dealing with Australian distributors. I went to the trouble of contacting them and discussing price, not trying to get them to compete with those prices, but I would have paid anything under AU$1000. Not possible. I checked with Adeal, the Australian Gitzo distributors too. So I tried to keep my dollars in Australia, but not to be.

OK, now, back to packing for a 3 day walk, the weather looks good!

EDIT.
PS I meant to say, three phone calls to the UK organising and paying for it all cost a grant total of 14 cents. Internet phone...

[corvus]

G'day All,
This online shop is a good reason to do your homework ,just one example Silva Helios Lighter can be purchased in Australia for around $40.00 they are asking $195.00 ??
How is this for stupidity check out their prices
http://www.p2s.com.au/se/camping_equipment.html
Regards
corvus